Halogen vs led
02-27-2015, 02:22 PM
#11
JK Junkie
Well, Sam, which ‘spot’ are you looking for -- 10 degree spot? 30 degree? 40?
The angle makes a big difference in how far the light gets. A 10deg’ spot will give x4 the light of a 20deg’ one at the same distance.
How far or how wide a light reaches, depends not only on the light source Lumen, but also on how the reflector and/or lens spread the light.
There aren’t LED and Halogen or HID lights that have exactly similar light spreads, so comparisons are usually worthless.
Even relatively small differences in light spread patterns between a Halogen, HID or LED, make meaningful differences in how much light is there at a certain distance.
Comparisons may only tell you which, of 2 specific lights, you prefer. For each of them, there are more alternatives which can reverse the conclusion.
There’s also the difference in light color. I’d rather not have some daylight color mixed with more yellowish lights, I prefer having all the lights in the same color. All my current and future lights are LED.
(One exceptions is the fog lights – for those who need them for fog or thick dust/haze – yellow light penetrates farther and is less reflected.)
The bottom line is that there’s no such thing as “A HID spot would light further than a LED spot” or vice versa.
If a specific HID gives 50% more Lumen than a specific LED, then just use 2 LEDs, and you’ll get more light than the HID.
Whatever lights you chose, they'll perform better and reach farther when mounted high, on a light bar above the windshield.
Two more points:
LED lights work for many years, they don't burn out as often as HID or Halogen.
Otherwise similar LED light sources, can have varying degrees of intensity.
Some manufacturers strain their lights in order to extract the maximum possible light intensity.
Others, such as Truck Lite or Rigid Industries, have a design policy of giving you some less Lumen, in order to increase long-term reliability.
My personal preference is sacrificing some light for gaining reliability. They still emit plenty of light.
The angle makes a big difference in how far the light gets. A 10deg’ spot will give x4 the light of a 20deg’ one at the same distance.
How far or how wide a light reaches, depends not only on the light source Lumen, but also on how the reflector and/or lens spread the light.
There aren’t LED and Halogen or HID lights that have exactly similar light spreads, so comparisons are usually worthless.
Even relatively small differences in light spread patterns between a Halogen, HID or LED, make meaningful differences in how much light is there at a certain distance.
Comparisons may only tell you which, of 2 specific lights, you prefer. For each of them, there are more alternatives which can reverse the conclusion.
There’s also the difference in light color. I’d rather not have some daylight color mixed with more yellowish lights, I prefer having all the lights in the same color. All my current and future lights are LED.
(One exceptions is the fog lights – for those who need them for fog or thick dust/haze – yellow light penetrates farther and is less reflected.)
The bottom line is that there’s no such thing as “A HID spot would light further than a LED spot” or vice versa.
If a specific HID gives 50% more Lumen than a specific LED, then just use 2 LEDs, and you’ll get more light than the HID.
Whatever lights you chose, they'll perform better and reach farther when mounted high, on a light bar above the windshield.
Two more points:
LED lights work for many years, they don't burn out as often as HID or Halogen.
Otherwise similar LED light sources, can have varying degrees of intensity.
Some manufacturers strain their lights in order to extract the maximum possible light intensity.
Others, such as Truck Lite or Rigid Industries, have a design policy of giving you some less Lumen, in order to increase long-term reliability.
My personal preference is sacrificing some light for gaining reliability. They still emit plenty of light.
02-28-2015, 01:16 PM
#13
Again, false information. as I have personally had my jeep parked next to my friends jeep who is a rigid dealer who was a 50" spot beam Rigid bar across his roof. whats that good for say 13,000 lumens according to rigid? my 2 Hella HID mounted on my MBRP bar on the bumper shine much farther down the road, Where as the LED bar just blobs out a crap load of light maybe to the edge of the high beam line. My HID hellas light up objects (non reflective) over 1000 m away. I.E. a bridge on our highway at the end of a LONG straight. And our highways are non lit unlike a lot of places. So lumens ratings have not very much to do with anything at all. Lumens is a marketing tool to get uneducated people to buy more lumens is better.
If you read my post more carefully, you would have understood it enough to avoid that statement.
I don't know about you, but lighting is something about which I have knowledge and experience.
I said –
“How far or how wide a light reaches, depends not only on the light source Lumen, but also on how the reflector and/or lens spread the light.
There aren’t LED and Halogen or HID lights that have exactly similar light spreads, so comparisons are usually worthless.
Even relatively small differences in light spread patterns between a Halogen, HID or LED, make meaningful differences in how much light is there at a certain distance..”
“my 2 Hella HID mounted on my MBRP bar on the bumper shine much farther down the road, Where as the LED bar just blobs out a crap load of light maybe to the edge of the high beam line.”
“lumens ratings have not very much to do with anything at all. Lumens is a marketing tool to get uneducated people to buy more lumens is better.”
I don’t understand your brushing it under the carpet… Obviously, a light source with more Lumen emits more light.
Then, comes in a very important factor -- how wide are those Lumen spread by a reflector and/or lens.
For the same Lumen and distance, a 10 degree light spread would result in 4 times more light per square ft. than a 20 degree spread.
As for -
“My HID hellas light up objects (non reflective) over 1000 m away”
-- We can’t hold a spot search light steady enough to stay on a target that far, without resting it on something solid. I had used long-range spotlights on vehicles. In order to stabilize the light spot I had to stop the vehicle. On some vehicles, even the vibrations of the idling engine were too much so we shut it off.A moving Jeep moves the light spot all over, as demonstrated by the following video:
(Click on it after the first video, to see another video of the spot while offroading) --As can be seen in the video, on a road which isn’t perfectly straight & horizontal, the light spot wonders all over the place.
A 1000 meter long-range spot is only useful on road sections which are at least 1000 meter long, smooth, level and straight. (and, there should be no head coming traffic.)
Not only that, but the very bright light spot which points everywhere but straight ahead, disturbs seeing the trail ahead.
Do some homework, and you'll find long-range LED spots. Not cheap, but with the advantages of LED vs HID of Halogen.
Last edited by GJeep; 03-01-2015 at 03:23 AM.
02-28-2015, 08:13 PM
#15
JK Enthusiast
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 180
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
03-01-2015, 09:43 AM
#17
JK Junkie
....."Again, false information. "
If you read my post more carefully, you would have understood it enough to avoid that statement.
I don't know about you, but lighting is something about which I have knowledge and experience.
I said –
“How far or how wide a light reaches, depends not only on the light source Lumen, but also on how the reflector and/or lens spread the light.
There aren’t LED and Halogen or HID lights that have exactly similar light spreads, so comparisons are usually worthless.
Even relatively small differences in light spread patterns between a Halogen, HID or LED, make meaningful differences in how much light is there at a certain distance..”
That’s a comparison of lights with different lights spreads, which makes it a non-valid comparison.
FYI, Lumen (or other scales) specification is the most basic data for any light source.
I don’t understand your brushing it under the carpet… Obviously, a light source with more Lumen emits more light.
Then, comes in a very important factor -- how wide are those Lumen spread by a reflector and/or lens.
For the same Lumen and distance, a 10 degree light spread would result in 4 times more light per square ft. than a 20 degree spread.
As for -
A moving Jeep moves the light spot all over, as demonstrated by the following video:
(Click on it after the first video, to see another video of the spot while offroading) --As can be seen in the video, on a road which isn’t perfectly straight & horizontal, the light spot wonders all over the place.
A 1000 meter long-range spot is only useful on road sections which are at least 1000 meter long, smooth, level and straight. (and, there should be no head coming traffic.)
Not only that, but the very bright light spot which points everywhere but straight ahead, disturbs seeing the trail ahead.
Do some homework, and you'll find long-range LED spots. Not cheap, but with the advantages of LED vs HID of Halogen.
If you read my post more carefully, you would have understood it enough to avoid that statement.
I don't know about you, but lighting is something about which I have knowledge and experience.
I said –
“How far or how wide a light reaches, depends not only on the light source Lumen, but also on how the reflector and/or lens spread the light.
There aren’t LED and Halogen or HID lights that have exactly similar light spreads, so comparisons are usually worthless.
Even relatively small differences in light spread patterns between a Halogen, HID or LED, make meaningful differences in how much light is there at a certain distance..”
“my 2 Hella HID mounted on my MBRP bar on the bumper shine much farther down the road, Where as the LED bar just blobs out a crap load of light maybe to the edge of the high beam line.”
“lumens ratings have not very much to do with anything at all. Lumens is a marketing tool to get uneducated people to buy more lumens is better.”
I don’t understand your brushing it under the carpet… Obviously, a light source with more Lumen emits more light.
Then, comes in a very important factor -- how wide are those Lumen spread by a reflector and/or lens.
For the same Lumen and distance, a 10 degree light spread would result in 4 times more light per square ft. than a 20 degree spread.
As for -
“My HID hellas light up objects (non reflective) over 1000 m away”
-- We can’t hold a spot search light steady enough to stay on a target that far, without resting it on something solid. I had used long-range spotlights on vehicles. In order to stabilize the light spot I had to stop the vehicle. On some vehicles, even the vibrations of the idling engine were too much so we shut it off.A moving Jeep moves the light spot all over, as demonstrated by the following video:
(Click on it after the first video, to see another video of the spot while offroading) --As can be seen in the video, on a road which isn’t perfectly straight & horizontal, the light spot wonders all over the place.
A 1000 meter long-range spot is only useful on road sections which are at least 1000 meter long, smooth, level and straight. (and, there should be no head coming traffic.)
Not only that, but the very bright light spot which points everywhere but straight ahead, disturbs seeing the trail ahead.
Do some homework, and you'll find long-range LED spots. Not cheap, but with the advantages of LED vs HID of Halogen.
As far as I am concerned. the 50" Rigid SPOT light bar should be comparable in beam pattern to my Hella driving lights, if its not, they should stop calling it a effing spot light. because it's obviously not. As for your comment about if the road is not perfect I should not be able to light up anything down range 1000m? Again, you have no idea what you're talking about as my lights at 1000m put out a fairly wide beam down that far. Wide enough to light up the overpass and hill behind the overpass while I am driving towards it. I think you are thinking lazer pointer. I used the eyeball test instead of any meters etc that are useless for testing real light useage. I hit my mileage reset button as soon as the overpass was visible to my eye and then clocked the mileage. 1km.....1000m was the distance. There are no other light sources and the moon was not out. It was a dark night, and that's the distance I measured off. My lights give me proper illumination from the front of my bumper on out to 1000m. Again, you have no idea what you are talking about with the comment if my lights light up that far they disturb my vision? NOPE, they work perfect, no massive hot spots, no dark spots, Just great light all the way out. I smell some Daniel stern theory here! Again I will say and stand by the statement LUMENS don't mean shit. You can have a light that puts out 1 million lumens, if it can use those effectively, then whats the point. Its sure bright to look at but totally useless as a light. And, again, LED BARS do not use their supposed lumens properly at all.....NO MATTER WHAT BAR. Vision X, rigid, Baja design, Chinese verisons. NONE can throw light down range worth a shit. Yep if you want a massive amount of light for 200 ft they are your light. If you want something to illuminate things a long way away like animals, etc that would be in your way or potential hazards then move on they are junk. HID or even halogen would work much better. LED lights are great for reverse lights, or marker lights that need to be seen. Also great for camp site or interior lights. For long distance lighting, NOPE. GO elsewhere.
The intensity light from ARB or the vision x light canon are the ONLY LED lights I would ever consider to install on my Jeep for driving in the night. But even then at almost a 1000 bucks a set, The performance per dollar is no where near what a HID will putout. I could go with a vision x 9" HID and it would completely out perform those 2 LED lights as well.
Last edited by Kojack; 03-01-2015 at 09:47 AM.
03-03-2015, 07:56 AM
#19
JK Junkie
I have had awesome results using hella 500 driving beam housings with 55w 4300k HIDs retrofitted in. whole setup is less than 200 bucks and worth every penny!
03-03-2015, 06:47 PM
#20
JK Enthusiast
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 297
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts