Originally Posted by Mbogan

I actually was really leaning toward the TJM. Looks great BtW. Well, I ended up doubting myself so much I changed direction and just ordered an LOD shorty bumper from Northridge. The all inclusive bumper with factory fogs and sunken winch made me spend a few extra $$. It will be here inn 3 weeks

Originally Posted by Mbogan

I am looking I for some advice based on experience here. I have been looking to find a stubby bumper that would allow using factory fog lights, winch, bull bar, painted black, and competitively priced. After doing some research I decided on the Or-Fab Stubby. It offered the aesthetics and functions I was looking for. I know there are many other brands available like JCR, Hanson, LOD, TJM,Rugged Ridge, Poison Spyder, Rought Country, etc. but felt Or-Fab was my best fit. So here is where I am getting caught up. There are two versions of the stubby. Option 1: Stubby with factory fog light cutout and ability to add a top mounted winch. Option 2: Stubby with out factory fog cutout, BUT with partially sunk winch mount. So, it's the winch mount option that's now throughout me. Am I better off with a partially sunk winch, scrapping fog lights and purchasing new? Or should I keep the factory lighting and add the top mounted winch option? Are the factory lights value warrant the decision to go top mount winch? What's the functional consideration that would sway that decision. Even though the initial setup cost is roughly the same, I would need to invest in additional lighting (which brings up the other debate of Dually D2 or traditional KC/PIAA styles) Any help choosing the based on pros and cons would be helpful

Originally Posted by Sahara Lee

I did bumpers front and rear (and carrier and shackles) for a ridiculously low price and no regrets. You are right that the stock headlights are (to quote Cartman) weak. The fogs do a good job of lighting the trail directly in front but if you want long-distance lighting you need MORE POWER. That's why I went with high output driving lights on top of my bull bar. BTW - even with the fogs spread out I still didn't have to modify factory wiring harness.

Originally Posted by iiM RuSHiN

I know you want factory fog lights, but speaking from experience I would recommend either upgrading your head lights or fogs. The stock headlights on these JK'S are horrible. I just spent upwards of $400 upgrading the headlights. You could do it by getting a high quality light and mounting it to the bumper. Just my 2 cents.

Originally Posted by GoBig

LOD makes great stuff...I have their sliders!