karls10jk

Cam bolts are only adjustable to a certain degree. They may be the 'best' solution for the parts that were provided but some control arm lowering brackets may be a better option in addition to removing those shiny bolts and replacing them with cam bolt eliminations.

It's available here as well- get some coffee and have a seat.

Dirtman's thoughts on lifts

Biginboca

With a 4" lift you need to address both Castor and Bump Steer. A heavy duty trackbar will not fix these issues and isn't necessary to fix what you are describing. Either or both of the above could be your issue, assuming your bolts are all torqued. Check that also because I have fixed lifts before where the issue was simply untorqued bolts by the installer.

Cam bolts, drop brackets, or lower control arms handle the castor.

High Steer kit with a flipped drag link and raised trackbar bracket would fix the bump steer. If you go this route your factory trackbar will pretty much center your axle and work fine.

4" Lifts that don't address these issues are low quality and should be avoided like the plague.

nthinuf

The shops reputation doesn't necessarily mean anything. They can all make mistakes, so maybe this one did not actually adjust the caster. Get the printout. Or have it re-checked. If you call around, some alignment shops will do it for free. They just throw it on the rack and print the 'before' specs, hoping that they can talk you into a full alignment.

Stock Caster is around 4.2 degrees. After your lift, it probably went down to the low 3's. With those cams, it should be back up near stock or a bit higher. Having the Toe spec is also good to know. (The Camber will not be adjustable from stock unless you add more components.)

You didn't mention if the drop pitman and front trackbar bracket are installed. If one was installed without the other, that can cause problems. (though it generally causes bumpsteer, so it doesn't sound like this is your problem.) Some people even indicate that running these together causes issues.

wilkie

Hey all. Thanks for the help. I had the local shop install rough country control arm drop brackets as shown above, and they also installed a Teraflex monster track bar. The jeep drives so much better! The steering is nice and tight and handles almost as good as stock. Thanks again!

nthinuf

So you got an adjustable trackbar to center the axle that was 'already centered' by the trackbar bracket. And you got control arm brackets to set the caster, instead of just adjusting the cams that were 'already installed'. Makes sense.

While they were at it, you should have had them flip the drag link to correct the steering angles that were already adjusted by the drop pitman...



Glad it all worked out for you.

wilkie

The cams for adjusting the caster are still there... By dropping the rear off both control arms we were able to get more castor correct? I'm no genius but yes it made major improvements in the handling of the jeep.

karls10jk

You really only need one or the other- drop brackets or the cam bolts. At this point you need "cam bolt eliminators" (large, thick washers) to get rid of the current cam washers.

I've not heard of anyone running both. There have been people that experimented with the drop brackets and adjustable lower control arms but you're not at that point yet.

nthinuf

Yep, they are different ways of doing the same thing. Cams and control arm brackets both rotate the housing to raise the caster. And the trackbar bracket (that was installed along with the drop pitman) centers the axle, which is what that new adj trackbar does.

Cams are adjustable. If the shop had set them correctly, it would have raised the caster and gotten rid of the flighty steering. But instead of finding out what your caster was set at and simply adjusting the cams - they were ignored and you added a second component (a second, second component...) to do the same job.

As karls noted, when the cams were installed, the holes in the brackets needed to be enlarged for them to fit. Since you don't really need both forms of caster correction, If/When you remove the cams, you will want to either have those enlarged holes welded back up, or buy one of the cam bolt eliminator kits.

Oh, and unlike the cams, don't remove that trackbar bracket. It works together with the drop pitman, and you won't care for the handling if you run one without the other.

wilkie

Ok, I'm starting to understand now. Thanks for the replies. So basically the shop told me the flighty steering was just because it was a lifted jeep, but since its better with the drop brackets evidently they didn't have the caster set correctly with the cam bolts?.. Is it possible they had the cams set as far as possible, and the brackets were able to do more then the cams or they were just lazy and didn't want to try and adjust the cams correctly the first time? Im happy the jeep is more stable but kinda bummed I may have wasted $750.00. Also I do still have the cam bolts installed along with the drop brackets, is this unsafe?

nthinuf

You didn't post the alignment specs, so there really isn't a way for us to tell. But yes, my guess was that they simply did not adjust the cams. (or, a few people on here have reported that their cams were installed backwards. )

No, cams aren't unsafe. The problem is that when you drive offroad, people say they tend to slip, which lowers the caster and puts you right back to the flighty steering you were trying to get rid of. If they stay tight, you shouldn't have any issues with them. But since you bought the brackets, why keep the cams?