Lockers: how much better are they?
10-24-2014, 08:59 AM
#1
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Lockers: how much better are they?
Understanding the little that I do about differentials, I surmise there are 3 main variations: open, limited slip, and locking.
My 2013 JKU has limited slip, and I'm trying to determine if I should shell out the cash for lockers considering the overlanding use I put the jeep through. I'm more about mud and snow than I am about rocks and boulders. I know lockers are better, but are they really that much better than my limited slip?
Anywho, I'll ask the question like this: On a scale of 1 to 10 when considering off road capabilities, if an open differential is a "1", and a locking differential is a "10", where does a JKU limited slip differential fall?
My 2013 JKU has limited slip, and I'm trying to determine if I should shell out the cash for lockers considering the overlanding use I put the jeep through. I'm more about mud and snow than I am about rocks and boulders. I know lockers are better, but are they really that much better than my limited slip?
Anywho, I'll ask the question like this: On a scale of 1 to 10 when considering off road capabilities, if an open differential is a "1", and a locking differential is a "10", where does a JKU limited slip differential fall?
Last edited by jdschup; 10-24-2014 at 11:50 AM.
10-24-2014, 09:14 AM
#2
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For Mud and Snow I think you're better off on the limited slip. Lockers are better in the rocks, the limited slip should outshine them or at least be equal in those conditions though as you Jeep will alternate power where its getting the traction making it sort of swim through stuff. If it's just snow and mud I'd leave the limited slip in.
10-24-2014, 09:39 AM
#3
JK Enthusiast
Here is a vid Air Locker vs LSD vs Traction Control
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNFacsKnswM"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNFacsKnswM
Here is another showing how much easier a locker makes life off road
(The first one can't even make it but the second one locked looks effortless)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXZqWt5JhYk"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXZqWt5JhYk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNFacsKnswM"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNFacsKnswM
Here is another showing how much easier a locker makes life off road
(The first one can't even make it but the second one locked looks effortless)https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXZqWt5JhYk"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXZqWt5JhYk
10-24-2014, 09:55 AM
#4
Bld
All JKs have Brake Lock Diffs.
I wouldn't spend the $ for the difference if you aren't playing in the rocks.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39rghzD8URY
I wouldn't spend the $ for the difference if you aren't playing in the rocks.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39rghzD8URY
10-24-2014, 11:32 AM
#5
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three times through rubicon trail with no lockers and only the rear lsd. That said, a couple of times i needed to get a little more aggressive on the throttle when trying to do large step ups/ steep slab rocks wheras my friends could just crawl it.
10-24-2014, 12:24 PM
#6
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Do you always travel with other vehicles? If you travel alone, do you have a winch? If you travel alone and don't have a winch...
The factory limited uses clutches, clutches tend to have a bad habit of wearing out and becoming just another open diff. Clutches can also have undesirable handling on slick roads (traction makes the clutch driven unit differentiate and slick conditions will prevent differentiation, which could cause understeer).
If you talk yourself into aftermarket traction, consider a truetrac. It is gear based, does not use clutches, and does not suffer from the slick road characteristics of a clutch based l/s.
An quote I liked from an old thread here, by the gentleman at Dynatrac:
The factory limited uses clutches, clutches tend to have a bad habit of wearing out and becoming just another open diff. Clutches can also have undesirable handling on slick roads (traction makes the clutch driven unit differentiate and slick conditions will prevent differentiation, which could cause understeer).
If you talk yourself into aftermarket traction, consider a truetrac. It is gear based, does not use clutches, and does not suffer from the slick road characteristics of a clutch based l/s.
An quote I liked from an old thread here, by the gentleman at Dynatrac:
The TT is your best option. For off road use a gear driven LSD (like the TT) is the only real LSD option we should consider. Clutch driven LSDs wear out very fast when a tire is lifted and spun. With a gear driven unit like the TT, free spinning the tire doesn't cause any damage and you don't lose any LSD function.
Years back I had Detroit Electracs in both ends of my Jeep. The Electrac was an electric selectable built by Tractech (the builder of the Detroit Locker before Eaton bought the Co.). It was TrueTrac based then switched to full lock. On one run where we had a lot of snow, mud and steep hills with wet roots the TT really showed its worth. I had numerous friends on the run that had ARBs. All day long I could hear them turning on and off their lockers. Never once that day did I use the lockers. I used only the TT LSD function the entire day. What that day showed me, very clearly, is that when most people hit the locker (ARB or similar) it's not because they need a locker, it's because they need something better than open.
For a moderate wheeler or a DD, the TT is a great option.
Years back I had Detroit Electracs in both ends of my Jeep. The Electrac was an electric selectable built by Tractech (the builder of the Detroit Locker before Eaton bought the Co.). It was TrueTrac based then switched to full lock. On one run where we had a lot of snow, mud and steep hills with wet roots the TT really showed its worth. I had numerous friends on the run that had ARBs. All day long I could hear them turning on and off their lockers. Never once that day did I use the lockers. I used only the TT LSD function the entire day. What that day showed me, very clearly, is that when most people hit the locker (ARB or similar) it's not because they need a locker, it's because they need something better than open.
For a moderate wheeler or a DD, the TT is a great option.
10-24-2014, 12:36 PM
#7
Since you already have a LSD in the rear I would just put a locker in the front for you need the extra traction.
This is one of best videos I have seen showing the advantage of front and rear locker.
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bvOgneVbVnE
This is one of best videos I have seen showing the advantage of front and rear locker.
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bvOgneVbVnE
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10-24-2014, 12:59 PM
#8
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Cheaper than the $3k and ARB system is going to cost me? Who installs them - just any good offroad shop? Who makes them?
Thanks for the great info!
10-24-2014, 01:10 PM
#10
While brake lock is okay when you have nothing else IMO it isn't all it's cracked up to be either. In order for it to work the axle must have a smooth and consistent slip. Rarely is this the case on the trail. Intermittent or moderate slip causes jerking and hesitations that are VERY hard on driveline parts.
Nothing other than a locked axle will allow for equal wheel speed of both tires and allow for controlled wheeling. Limited slip and brake locking shift the torque from one side of the axle to the other. and an open diff will allow for constant and equal torque to be applied to both tires.
A locked axle does have disadvantages though, so I am not a fan of the full-time variants. For me the only real option is a selectable locker for someone that regularly does trail riding.
This said, if you do not have a winch, I think money is better spent there first. It WILL get you out of trouble, where a locker may or may not.
Nothing other than a locked axle will allow for equal wheel speed of both tires and allow for controlled wheeling. Limited slip and brake locking shift the torque from one side of the axle to the other. and an open diff will allow for constant and equal torque to be applied to both tires.
A locked axle does have disadvantages though, so I am not a fan of the full-time variants. For me the only real option is a selectable locker for someone that regularly does trail riding.
This said, if you do not have a winch, I think money is better spent there first. It WILL get you out of trouble, where a locker may or may not.