What C - Gussets to get and where to have the installed (Jersey Shore Area)?!
06-20-2014, 06:51 AM
#21
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Good information in this thread! You guys really know your stuff. If I may add just a little bit more. You originally asked about gussets but axles can be reinforced in a number of ways...
Sleeving reinforcement can be done in two ways. Internal sleeves are inserted into the axle housing and increase the "thickness" of the housing between the housing and the axle. Some manufactures of internal sleeves are: Rock-Slide Engineering, Poly Performance, Tereflex, Iron Rock, EVO, and Nitro. I believe all but the Nitro require holes to be drilled in the housing then plug welding the sleeve to the axle tubes. The Nitro is pressed/(pounded) into place using friction of a precision fit. Nitro sleeves are preferred by some as they have a slightly larger I.D (resulting in a thinner wall thickness) that is just large enough to allow use of 35 spline axles.
An alternate method is to sleeve the outside of the housing. Rock Slide Engineering has an outer sleeve kit. This increases the "thickness" of the axle tube by adding material to the external or outside of the tubing.
Gusseting is installed at least on the upper sections of the "C" where the "C" is the weakest. However, gussets can be installed on the lower section as well . There are two options for these. Solid flat (and thick) gussets are available through Rock Slide, Terraflex, JKS, TMR, and Pure Jeep. The other option is thinner gauge metal that is formed into a "U" shape and is welded in place on both sides of the "U" channel of the gusset to the outer edges of the "C" section. This style can be obtained through, Poly Performance, Iron Rock, Nitro, and EVO.. Some users have stated that part of the "U" section can interfere with the speed sensor (when the wheels are fully turned to the steering stop) while others have not experienced (or expressed) this.
Trusses (reinforce the entire axle tube assembly and are welded to the "pumkin" and typically to each side of the housing) are available from Pure Jeep and Artec.
The topic of how much reinforcement is enough has been discussed numerous times with almost as many opinions. However, all agree that running larger tires should include at least some reinforcement and how "extreme" you wheel should be taken into consideration. Obviously, if you haven't bent your axle you are OK. However, if you have bent it, the reinforcement installed was not enough.
Larger tires is a bit like swinging a hammer using a longer handle.
When my gussets were welded I left the factory ball joints in and alternated welding each side and cooled with a wet rag frequently. No problems with the ball joints have been observed.
I was originally going to use the thick ones but someone familiar with metal engineering advised that the thinner ones would actually be stronger so I went with his advise.
My $.02 worth, ah what the heck, make it a nickle
KG6SLC aka Eugene
Sleeving reinforcement can be done in two ways. Internal sleeves are inserted into the axle housing and increase the "thickness" of the housing between the housing and the axle. Some manufactures of internal sleeves are: Rock-Slide Engineering, Poly Performance, Tereflex, Iron Rock, EVO, and Nitro. I believe all but the Nitro require holes to be drilled in the housing then plug welding the sleeve to the axle tubes. The Nitro is pressed/(pounded) into place using friction of a precision fit. Nitro sleeves are preferred by some as they have a slightly larger I.D (resulting in a thinner wall thickness) that is just large enough to allow use of 35 spline axles.
An alternate method is to sleeve the outside of the housing. Rock Slide Engineering has an outer sleeve kit. This increases the "thickness" of the axle tube by adding material to the external or outside of the tubing.
Gusseting is installed at least on the upper sections of the "C" where the "C" is the weakest. However, gussets can be installed on the lower section as well . There are two options for these. Solid flat (and thick) gussets are available through Rock Slide, Terraflex, JKS, TMR, and Pure Jeep. The other option is thinner gauge metal that is formed into a "U" shape and is welded in place on both sides of the "U" channel of the gusset to the outer edges of the "C" section. This style can be obtained through, Poly Performance, Iron Rock, Nitro, and EVO.. Some users have stated that part of the "U" section can interfere with the speed sensor (when the wheels are fully turned to the steering stop) while others have not experienced (or expressed) this.
Trusses (reinforce the entire axle tube assembly and are welded to the "pumkin" and typically to each side of the housing) are available from Pure Jeep and Artec.
The topic of how much reinforcement is enough has been discussed numerous times with almost as many opinions. However, all agree that running larger tires should include at least some reinforcement and how "extreme" you wheel should be taken into consideration. Obviously, if you haven't bent your axle you are OK. However, if you have bent it, the reinforcement installed was not enough.
Larger tires is a bit like swinging a hammer using a longer handle.
When my gussets were welded I left the factory ball joints in and alternated welding each side and cooled with a wet rag frequently. No problems with the ball joints have been observed.
I was originally going to use the thick ones but someone familiar with metal engineering advised that the thinner ones would actually be stronger so I went with his advise.
My $.02 worth, ah what the heck, make it a nickle
KG6SLC aka Eugene
My question is, did you go with Teraflex style gussets or the the thinner, Evo style gussets. I have been trying to determine which would work best with my rig/lift (AEV 2.5). There is a sway bar link bracket that is bound to be in the way. I am thinking an easy way to get around this would be to remove the bracket and run longer links. You guys think thats the way to go? It sure seems easier then having to modify the bracket and will be able to run the Artec gussets without any issues. Next question would be what links. I have a rubi with the stock e discos, but wouldn't be opposed to having a set of quick discos as well. I think most of the extended links are quick disconnects anyway.
As for how extreme I am going, the trails my rig sees are for the most part, light and easy. A few steep hill climbs here and there but that is about as crazy as I have gotten. I get out to Rauch twice a year, but stay on the 1's and 2's and watch the big boys take on the harder trails. This Jeep see's more street then trail so I think trusses and external sleeves are overkill for me, but maybe not for somebody else! Nitro sleeves have been added to my list and I think will be the perfect piece of insurance.
I really appriciate you taking the time to go through each piece of the puzzle. Maybe if the forum was filled with well informed people like yourself, builds like Del Ray Customs would be fewer and far between.
However, it seems that I have managed to catch the eye of some very helpful and smart Jeepers. Thanks for all the info everybody!
06-20-2014, 08:12 PM
#23
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Hi all, I'm wanting to install the complete artec gusset and truss kit on my front d30 and rear d44, my question is would I benefit from sleeves as well?
Thanks
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Thanks
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06-20-2014, 08:16 PM
#24
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06-24-2014, 08:53 PM
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GUSSETS etc.
Thanks for the feedback. Glad the information was helpful. Always glad to help a fellow Jeep owner.
In answering questions, both PM and this thread, I went with the EVO route. Very happy with the result. Was initially concerned about the top gusset hitting the spring during the trial fit, but it does not appear to interfere even though it touches prior to all of the weight being put on the axle. The EVO uses the thinner gauge metal but is formed into a "U" and is welded both sides of the "U" making for a strong install. The gussets did not touch or interfere with any other mounts or bars. I had a certified welder do my install and they look really good and have good, smooth penetration welds. I subsequently applied some black spray paint to the gussets and skids for appearance and rust protection.
My JKU is a Rubicon so I have the electronic disconnect swaybar.
My build will include larger tires (35's) with no lift using either Overline or Overland tube fenders. That way I never have to worry about (or have) Death Wobble and maintain a lower center of gravity. So questions asked regarding control arms, links, and mounts, are not part of my area of expertise and do not want to mislead anyone looking for that information.
I thought about doing a truss as well but I don't do extreme wheeling. I don't have to have my kidneys hurt to know I've had a good time.
For what it is worth, one of the gussets went awol between the trial fit and welding and could not find it anywhere. I contacted EVO with my dilemma. They sent me a single gusset quickly and at a reasonable price. Kudos to EVO.
KG6SLC aka Eugene
In answering questions, both PM and this thread, I went with the EVO route. Very happy with the result. Was initially concerned about the top gusset hitting the spring during the trial fit, but it does not appear to interfere even though it touches prior to all of the weight being put on the axle. The EVO uses the thinner gauge metal but is formed into a "U" and is welded both sides of the "U" making for a strong install. The gussets did not touch or interfere with any other mounts or bars. I had a certified welder do my install and they look really good and have good, smooth penetration welds. I subsequently applied some black spray paint to the gussets and skids for appearance and rust protection.
My JKU is a Rubicon so I have the electronic disconnect swaybar.
My build will include larger tires (35's) with no lift using either Overline or Overland tube fenders. That way I never have to worry about (or have) Death Wobble and maintain a lower center of gravity. So questions asked regarding control arms, links, and mounts, are not part of my area of expertise and do not want to mislead anyone looking for that information.
I thought about doing a truss as well but I don't do extreme wheeling. I don't have to have my kidneys hurt to know I've had a good time.
For what it is worth, one of the gussets went awol between the trial fit and welding and could not find it anywhere. I contacted EVO with my dilemma. They sent me a single gusset quickly and at a reasonable price. Kudos to EVO.
KG6SLC aka Eugene
06-25-2014, 07:55 AM
#26
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Thanks for the feedback. Glad the information was helpful. Always glad to help a fellow Jeep owner.
The EVO uses the thinner gauge metal but is formed into a "U" and is welded both sides of the "U" making for a strong install. The gussets did not touch or interfere with any other mounts or bars. I had a certified welder do my install and they look really good and have good, smooth penetration welds. I subsequently applied some black spray paint to the gussets and skids for appearance and rust protection.
They sent me a single gusset quickly and at a reasonable price. Kudos to EVO.
KG6SLC aka Eugene
The EVO uses the thinner gauge metal but is formed into a "U" and is welded both sides of the "U" making for a strong install. The gussets did not touch or interfere with any other mounts or bars. I had a certified welder do my install and they look really good and have good, smooth penetration welds. I subsequently applied some black spray paint to the gussets and skids for appearance and rust protection.
They sent me a single gusset quickly and at a reasonable price. Kudos to EVO.
KG6SLC aka Eugene
) and will have him check out what I have and see what he thinks would be best. It is also good to see EVO stepping up and helping you out. I have always seen positive reviews about those guys and it is good to see they are continuing their support for the scene. 
07-23-2014, 06:39 AM
#28
JK Super Freak
With 35" tires and light/moderate wheeling, would sleeves or the axle truss be more useful? I am going to be doing the C's but wonder if I should do the truss or sleeve.
07-23-2014, 08:03 AM
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This has been answered before in the thread. Each piece has their benefits, and to some a truss AND a sleeve are overkill, but worth the extra insurance. For me, one who wheels lightly and watches the big dogs play, a sleeve on my d44 is all I will ever need. If you think you need a truss for what you want to do with your rig, then by all means go for it! If you have a d30, I think it would be recommended as the axle tubes are much smaller. My stock d44 has held up great, but added the nitro sleeves to be safe. Bottom line, it all comes down to how hard you wheel. Hard wheeling on a d30, go for it. Light wheeling with a d44, would be fine with just sleeves. Hard wheeling d44, a bit of a toss up, but would be a worth upgrade. Just my 2cents.
