Wrangler JK's vs. others on the trail....
 

So, I wanted to post a fun thread on how our beloved JK's differ from other off-road capable vehicles. Now, for starters, I hope I am able to start/discuss such a topic with naming other makes (such as an FJ or Hummer or Range Rover).

I shall soon find out I guess. Anyway, back to the topic at hand. I wanna hear it from the horses mouth. Whether it be the "by the book" answer/response or the "in my own words" answer/response. Lets hear how our JK will fair better over the said vehicle on the trail, from articulation, body length, different suspension set-ups(independent, semi-independent), axle/frame types, weight, options(electronic sway bar disco, auto lift/lower), horsepower, torque, so on and so forth.

Lets start off with the oh so expensive Range Rover. As some of you know, these are supposed to be very off-road capable, have a ton of options, etc. But, you can almost buy 3 JK's for the price of one of these. THIS IS WHAT I STARTED THIS THREAD FOR!! :thumbsup: I wanna hear how...say, our JK is better for the trails as supposed to a $90k+ Range Rover. Whether its good or bad, biased or not, the "legit" answer or "opinion".... Lets break-down all the categories and compare and see what we come up with! Then when we pretty much hit all the key points, we'll switch it up to another make/model.

What do you all think? Lets have some fun on this Friday! GETCHA PULL!

:munching:

A few of us ran into a heavily modded Toyota land cruiser a little while back and she got stuck on the first obstacle and we all drove over it like nothing was there. :yup:

Too funny... now, lets ask this - what do you think was the problem as to why she got stuck(other than being a female.......TOTALLY JK!:rotflmao2:) as supposed to you guys going right through? Frame length? Weight? Less articulation? Anything besides the obvious "tires" ya know, cause while that is beneficial on the trail, anyone can switch tires easier than say, a whole suspension swap.

Care to enlighten us on as to why you say they are, besides just "saying" they are? :hmm: :beer:

orrrrrrrrrrrrr maybe not..................hahaha

I'm pretty sure she was running km2s so the tires weren't the problem. I know she wasn't aired down which was a small problem and less articulation. We all had 4 wheels on the ground and she was going on three wheels. Oh yeah and she was a woman. :rotlfmao2:

It all depends on what trails you want to run and how good of a driver you are. We came across a Subaru Outback in the middle of White Rim Trail last year. Now, that's more of a Moderate trail than a Difficult one, but still. It's long, rocky in spots, and has a few points that'll definitely get your attention. The Outback was a little beat up -- yet they were doing WRT just fine. It's amazing what you can do with the right technique.

Here's a Crown Vic doing Hell's Revenge: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KFwPXEeJ3aI

Now don't we all feel like badasses with our Rubicons and modded-out JKs? :rotflmao2:

I have a hard time believing a Land Cruiser got stuck on anything (except an extreme trail) and it wasn't driver error.

WHAT THE :cursing: @ the Crown Vic!

I would have to agree it has to do with driver experience, u can have a rock buggy and get it stuck if u don't know what your doing. I grew up in a 87 4runner and that thing is still running and in the family and it still does trails, now it may not have the articulation that my jk does but it typically will go most places I have gone except the hard trails I have run.

So a story for you all. When I started wheeling I had a 91 limited Cherokee I ran an easy trail called mt baldy here in Colorado. I was still stock at this point and was taking my time up the what was a bumpy trail rated at a moderate before they plowed it. Well about half way up a club of land Rovers/range rovers came up behind me, I pulled off to let them pass as I was the slower going one. Finally we reach the top which is just below 13000 feet, after some time of enjoying the view and pictures my buddy and I get back in the xj and look around, three of the club that had passed me before had they hoods up, all of the club members were still there so I had to do a three point turn to get around them and head out, but not before seeing they couldn't get there rigs started my little 2000$ rig started just fine.....

I rolled out of my 2008 JKU Rubi into a 2010 Hummer H3T w/ Adv Package in August 2010. Needed the pickup bed aspect but wanted to keep the 4x4 capabilities.

I have to say my overall experience with the Hummer has been good. I believe that stock vs. stock in the 2 trims I had, I prefer the Hummer for every day use and light wheeling. I also like the all time 4wd. I have experienced the exact 16.5 (+/-) MPG (80/20 city vs hwy usage) on both rides.

The adventure package delivered some of the capability that a lot of Rubi owners find themselves upgrading to. Including gears, tires etc. The IFS would eventually limit the H3T though.

Overall, the hard core wheelers would max out the Hummer well before a lightly modded JKU Rubi.

To each their own, but both of these are quite capable. Here are the basic specs between the 2:


2010 H3T (Adv Pkg) vs. 2008 Rubicon Unl.
approach 38.7 / 44.4
departure 30.1 / 40.5
breakover 21.2 / 20.8
gr clearance 9.5 / 10.1
wh base 134.2 / 116
length 210.3 / 173.4
HP 242 / 202
Torque 242 / 237
Gears 4.56 / 4.1
T Case 4.03:1 / 4:1
Crawl 68.9:1 / 73.1
Tires/Rim 33 /16" / 32 / 17"
F/R eLockers Y / Y
Tranny 5sp / 6sp

RB

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z0Fkbnme88w http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jLBg4-dI05A&feature=related http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHF_ToYYJww
Summary from the video below

"Summary - Defender better on loose surface deep roots & muddy trails, Rubicon much more practical & comfy, plus cabrio version in 10 minutes, and auto. and petrol... That all means - Jeep is better for real life, LR for duties, and hard muddy conditions."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92ZqtbABNgA

VS. a LR Discovery, the 4-door has a way better departure angle. I smacked the trailer hitch or rear bumper on my Disco so many times. I had permanently removed the corner trim pieces above the bumper because they would get knocked off so often.

Comfort-wise, the Jeep couldn't touch the LR. The drive to and from the trail were worlds apart.
Interior space / storage, again the LR would win. The back of the Disco could swallow loads of gear.

Off-road ability hands down goes to the Rubicon Unltd. Clearance, traction, front and rear lockers, etc...

Intangibles - top off, doors off obviously goes to the Jeep. Aftermarket manufacturers also support the Jeep community in numbers that dwarf the LR supporters. No contest.


My G4 Discovery

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/o...4f1106cb_o.jpg


My JKU

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/o.../P1080165a.jpg

ok, i'll go with my experience.

my early broncos had a 3" lift, 33s, 4:11s, air lockers front and rear, 302V8s, C4 auto, D20 transfer case (about 2.4 low range), Ford 9" rear, Dana 44 front. the early broncos had coil front with a long radius arm so when lifted all you had to do is replace the poly "C" bushings to correct caster and there were no caster issues. they had leafs in the rear that i replaced with taller more flexible ones with my lifts. their advantage other than being really cool classics is that with the leaf rears they were a lot more stable side to side on the trail. with the short 96" wheel base and the frame and everything else tucked up in the body i never had a problem dragging on anything underneath. but since the rocker panels extended below the frame they were easy to damage. front and rear overhang wasn't bad, but not as good as the JK. dash was low and you could see your front fender corners easily. one disadvantage was the taller range transfer case and although the 302s had 200 HP they seemed to run out of power on a hill climb so you needed more speed. another was going down a steep hill with the auto you'd fly down unless you were on the brakes all the time. rock crawling in them was great. people riding in the back seat got hammered since the ride was so rough back there. they were hell for stout. i worked a lot on mine replacing things and they were pretty reliable but when we're on bronco runs today there's usually someone having a cooling, electrical or some mechanical problem since they're just old. i love the early broncos though and wish i had room to have kept mine along with my jeep.

my brother has had lots of scouts, also hell for stout. disadvantage is front leafs that usually use longer shackles for a lift and steering can be pretty wandering. longer wheel base, rode much better on the trail than the broncos. one advantage is their engines are really torquey. disadvantage is long front and rear overhang.

next was my 1998 XJ with the 4.0L, auto, stock except for 31" tires. only mild wheeling with it. jostled severly side to side and i banged my head on the side window more than once. hit the exhaust Y pipe going over things that weren't very big.

next was my 2006 LJ Rubi, auto, 4" lift, 33s, 4:56s. awesome 4 wheeling articulation, no underneath dragging issues, great hill descent control, didn't have to fix any of the stock setup to make it work. went over everything like butter. disadvantages were on the highway when in overdrive going up even a slight grade it was like pushing a rope, very tall dash - had to sit on a cusion to see the front fenders, and getting into the back seat was a pain.

my 2012 JK Rubi is just awesome on the trail. still more side to side jounce than the broncos, but rides nicer on the trail. goes up things like butter even if a tire or two is lifted. hill descent is awesome. select shift auto is awesome. new engine is awesome. 4 dr convenience and comfort is awesome. new lower geared auto is awesome but wish it had a taller overdrive. disadvantage is long weelbase and less clearence underneath and having a brand new $40K jeep that needs a new drive shaft, relocated or new evap skid, or exhaust extensions or y pipe mod to avoid damaging stock components on the trail with even a mild lift. but i love it anyway, new techology reigns!!:clap:

Lovin' all these awesome stories and videos and personal experiences.... keep em comin'! :ya:

[QUOTE=deeker;2894073]VS. a LR Discovery, the 4-door has a way better departure angle. I smacked the trailer hitch or rear bumper on my Disco so many times. I had permanently removed the corner trim pieces above the bumper because they would get knocked off so often.

Comfort-wise, the Jeep couldn't touch the LR. The drive to and from the trail were worlds apart.
Interior space / storage, again the LR would win. The back of the Disco could swallow loads of gear.

Off-road ability hands down goes to the Rubicon Unltd. Clearance, traction, front and rear lockers, etc...

Intangibles - top off, doors off obviously goes to the Jeep. Aftermarket manufacturers also support the Jeep community in numbers that dwarf the LR supporters. No contest.


My G4 Discovery

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/o...4f1106cb_o.jpg


Hi

Outside USA I think that many like my self see the Landrover Discovery more like a city SUV or farmers with horses and the Landrover Defender a real 4x4 terrain vehicle. The Defender is popular in Africa (many in South Africa), Australia and Europe.

As a Swede I could choose between the Defender and Wrangler, ordered a Wrangler, ordered june 2011 and not got it yet! I would not even think of a disco, just look like a ordinary SUV.

The Defender is to high for my Garage
Defender more expensive
Wanted automatic, Defender only manual
Defender only diesel, dont want that. I south Africa they had V8 petrol.

Defender has a "older" interior design and drives like a tractor, so Wrangler is more refined and more car like.

Defender is more like a tank and a farmer vehicle and has better aproach angles and departure angles and ground clearance than a Wrangler. The Defender is no toy, You can walk on the bonnet, walk on the roof and put a tent on it and it is built for that, its a working 4x4 vehicle, a real tank and not for soccermoms.

They Russian guy say almost that a wrangler Rubicon is a "car" and the Defender is a terrain vehicle after his test. But I think the are very similar.

All the terrain thing is better on the Defender and the car like thing is better on the Wrangler, almost what the Russian tester say.

"approximately equal off-road abilities, a little better angles - plus for Def, transfer case shield to low - minus for Rubi, jeep's engine much more powerful, but Landy's antistall system is the best.

"Defender better on loose surface deep roots & muddy trails, Rubicon much more practical & comfy, plus cabrio version in 10 minutes, and auto. and petrol... That all means - Jeep is better for real life, LR for duties, and hard muddy conditions."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92ZqtbABNgA Look at very little overhang on a Defender

http://newcarscollections.com/wp-con...efender-90.jpg

Some statistic:

EU Wrangler bumper:

Approach angle 38.4 deg.

Departure angle 31.3 deg.

US Wrangler bumper:

Approach angle 40.8 deg

Departure angle 37.4 deg

Landrover Defender :

Approach angle 49 deg.

Departure angle 47 deg.

http://www.landrover.com/imagery/glo...de-850x425.jpg


Look at the height, Defender about 12.7"? in ground clearance, Wrangler about 10" in ground clearance

http://www.vrelegume.rs/slike/175/upt504.jpg

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-CRa8197jtp...25283%2529.jpg

Hi

Worldwide Jeep want to be the best 4x4 but for us outside USA and Canada, the rest of the world, Jeep gave us a vehicle with one of the worst approach angle of any 4x4 in he world.

Look at this plow bill bumper, what is it purpose? and US bumper aint so god either.

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1153/...92a4f100_o.jpg

I have a Suzuki Jimny like this, look at the approach angle

http://www.cars-directory.net/pics/s...724_8_orig.jpg


Some statistic:

EU Wrangler bumper:

Approach angle 38.4 deg.

Departure angle 31.3 deg.

US Wrangler bumper:

Approach angle 40.8 deg

Departure angle 37.4 deg

Landrover Defender :

Approach angle 49 deg.

Departure angle 47 deg.

My old 2001 Suzuki Jimny :

Approach angle 42 deg.

Departure angle 46 deg.

Suzuki Samurai: ???

Approach angle 48 deg

Departure angle 40 deg.

Hummer H1:

Approach angle 72

Departure angle 37.5

Lada Niva:

Approach angle 40 deg.

Departure angle 32 deg.

Mercedes Geländewagen:

Approach angle 40 deg