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Budget tailgate fix ordered. Mor/Ryde hinges and MBRP re-inforcment.

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Budget tailgate fix ordered. Mor/Ryde hinges and MBRP re-inforcment.

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Old 09-15-2017, 01:44 PM
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How snug should the hinge pins be? Mine weren't taking grease so I loosened them up a touch (without weight) and got grease flowing again. They grease properly now but how snug is snug there?
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Old 09-16-2017, 02:56 AM
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Originally Posted by karls10jk View Post
How snug should the hinge pins be? Mine weren't taking grease so I loosened them up a touch (without weight) and got grease flowing again. They grease properly now but how snug is snug there?
As you said, it may be easier to get grease to flow out of the hinge pins if you loosen them a bit. After you loosen them for greasing, force grease in until it oozes out of the ends of the hinge pins a bit , and then they should be tightened to the point where they just start to have some resistance. They should still swing easily, but you should be able to feel a very slight resistance to turning.
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Old 09-18-2017, 03:23 AM
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I installed one of the preproduction door hinges to finalize a design for mounting a step.



The mounting hardware worked out very easily; it's just a mounting plate, a nut plate that slides inside the hinge, and a few bolts and nuts. The bolts I used wouldn't be the final choice if these went into production, they're just what I had handy. And I haven't painted the mounting plate yet, it's still raw steel.

The step performed just fine in the 225-lb. gorilla test.



One thing I like about this design vs. the other door hinge steps on the market is that you don't have to remove the hinge bolts to install/remove the step - the step installs to the hinge without touching the door hinge bolts, so it's a lot easier to install/remove. It's quick to install, so I'll probably only have the steps on the Jeep when I've got the rack on the top, and I'll remove the steps when I remove the rack.

I did some research on the other hinge-mount steps on the market, and with some help from my friend Donny who has Kargo Master steps on his Jeep discovered that all of the other steps on the market interfere with the front door when they're hinged down and the rear door is open:



The way this step mounts directly to the bottom hinge, it doesn't interfere:



On the other hand, this step is lower than Donny's Kargo Master step because that step mounts on a bar between the two hinges.

So now some design decisions... about the step being mounted to the lower hinge, lower than the Kargo Master step; I'm 6'6" but a 5'6" friend of mine also tried it and felt that it was a good height - not so high that stepping up from the ground was too hard, and not too low to make it hard to access things on the rack. Also being mounted lower it doesn't interfere with the front door like the others on the market. And if needed a second step could be mounted on the upper hinge, which would allow for climbing higher than the Kargo Master single step. BTW a step on the upper hinge would interfere with the driver's door when the back door was open, just like the Kargo Master interferes. A step on the bottom hinge never interferes.

I could add a bar like the Kargo Master and mount the steps to the bar, and there could be several mounting locations on the bar for one or two steps, but that would add cost - as it is I spent about $11 for the step itself (paid retail), and the mounting bracket is a simple laser-cut piece of steel so it would be very inexpensive.

I welcome your thoughts on this.
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Old 09-18-2017, 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by jscherb View Post
One of the stops I always make on my way to Colorado is the huge Iowa 80 truck stop ("Worlds Largest", or so they say). Stopped there today and picked up two folding steps to build a prototype with the new HD hinges.

.....

Opinions on either approach welcome.
So here's my thoughts. At first I thought cool! Then I thought - what about the weight? Then I thought - but it's an upgraded hinge so it should be able to support it.... and then it hit me - is the other side - the body side - strong enough to take the extra weight? Lets face it, the extra weight could be about 180lbs + (and in some of our cases - lets me honest... a big +). This could put strain on the body side - resulting in damage..... but that's just my $0.02 (btw I am talking about the door hingest not the tailgate hing)
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Old 09-18-2017, 07:51 PM
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Originally Posted by kejtar View Post
So here's my thoughts. At first I thought cool! Then I thought - what about the weight? Then I thought - but it's an upgraded hinge so it should be able to support it.... and then it hit me - is the other side - the body side - strong enough to take the extra weight? Lets face it, the extra weight could be about 180lbs + (and in some of our cases - lets me honest... a big +). This could put strain on the body side - resulting in damage..... but that's just my $0.02 (btw I am talking about the door hingest not the tailgate hing)
The weight one might put on the step is well within the capacity of the door frame + hinge to support, but I'll continue testing the steps on my Jeep; my weight fully clothed is about 230 lbs.
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Old 09-18-2017, 07:52 PM
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Using the same mounting bracket, steps can be installed on the HD tailgate hinges.



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Old 09-19-2017, 08:29 AM
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Originally Posted by jscherb View Post
The weight one might put on the step is well within the capacity of the door frame + hinge to support, but I'll continue testing the steps on my Jeep; my weight fully clothed is about 230 lbs.
Not that I want to challenge this statement too much as you have done some amazing work to date BUT (there is always a butt ) how well is the sheet metal in the frame reinforced for the hinge? I haven't taken the plastics off on my JK to look at the mounts from the inside, but if it's like any other vehicles I've worked on I imagine it's only a plate to secure the hinge with no support going down. This makes me question the additional weight (vertically) on a single hinge or even distributed between the two. Granted you can stand on it couple times but it's like an effect of a kid standing on an upended cardboard box - the box will survive couple attempts but with each one of them there will be put stress onto material which will cause failure in a long run. I think that if you were to make steps on the door hinges, you'd want to put in a bracket on the backside that would spread the weight more and even maybe stand down to the frame?
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Old 09-19-2017, 11:08 AM
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Originally Posted by kejtar View Post
Not that I want to challenge this statement too much as you have done some amazing work to date BUT (there is always a butt ) how well is the sheet metal in the frame reinforced for the hinge? I haven't taken the plastics off on my JK to look at the mounts from the inside, but if it's like any other vehicles I've worked on I imagine it's only a plate to secure the hinge with no support going down. This makes me question the additional weight (vertically) on a single hinge or even distributed between the two. Granted you can stand on it couple times but it's like an effect of a kid standing on an upended cardboard box - the box will survive couple attempts but with each one of them there will be put stress onto material which will cause failure in a long run. I think that if you were to make steps on the door hinges, you'd want to put in a bracket on the backside that would spread the weight more and even maybe stand down to the frame?
The pillar between the doors is made up of multiple formed components welded together into a strong structural member. You don't need to remove the interior plastic trim to see this, if you pry up the edge of the trim a little you can see inside. This image from the factory service manual may help. The structure is strong enough to support the step.



The idea of putting steps on the hinges is not unique to me, Kargo Master I think was the first and there are now several others on the market.
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Old 09-19-2017, 11:31 AM
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in that case cool!!!!!
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Old 10-12-2017, 07:32 AM
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When last I posted about the door hinge steps, I had made up a quick prototype and did a test install to verify the fit and that they supported a 225-lb. gorilla. I'm planning an RTT camping trip to Death Valley in a few weeks and the steps will be very handy, so I made up a second one, painted them and installed one on each side. While installing more of the new HD door hinges, I took photos of what can be expected in most JK's up through the mid-'15 model year.

This almost looks innocent, but it's a sign of much larger problems:



From the outside, the hinge in this next photo didn't look anywhere near as bad as the one above, but unbolting it reveals:



I'll need to sand off the corrosion and refinish the area under the hinges so that the sheet metal doesn't deteriorate any further.

A hinge and step installed:



The steps are pretty simple devices, this is a photo of the parts. The one on the left is assembled; the one on the right is disassembled - two pieces of steel plate, some bolts/nuts/washers, and the step. A step can be installed/removed in less than a minute without touching the door hinge bolts, so I'll probably only have them on the Jeep when I'm on an expedition where I'll need them.

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