ktoth87

I didn't use grease I brushed the same gear oil I used to fill it on the splines and twisted in.

spinuck

So what was the outcome?

ktoth87

Well I decided to use my experience and people with years of automotive experience opinions. And I'm currently testing my theory about using silicone on the seals. In the years that I turned wrenches professionally I never put silicone on seals. When I first pulled this apart and saw it, I was in shock and even called dynatrac and asked if they normally use silicone and the gentleman said yes. So before I pulled it apart for the second time both sides are leaking. I decided to replace just the short tube seal without silicone and just clean up the long tube and see what happens. Visually inspected long tube from where the carrier sits and just like all of the seals I have sitting around now, none are torn. After a few days of driving long side still leaks, short side however is dry as could be. That's about a week of driving roughly 125 miles. I have noticed that the long tube only leaks when it's angled downward. Tomorrow I'm pulling it apart for the third time to replace the long tube. And hopefully no leaks.

I have noticed something hopefully someone can chime in on. I'm not a professional welder by any means and only have minor experience welding but I'm attaching some pictures of something that doesn't look right to me.

ktoth87

Ok finished up the seals for the third time now without silicone and took it for a short drive and there's nothing. Time will tell on this. So I'll be driving the jeep to work for the week and see what happens. I did for shits and giggles come up with a way to test and see if "I tore the seals". I took one of the old ones that was leaking and put it around the shaft and filled up the wet side with air tool oil which is very thin. And let it sit and there was zero leaking. I waited about 10 minutes and then I twisted the seal and moved it down to see if there was any change, none. Then I let it sit for 30ish minutes until I needed the shaft for reassembly. There is three pictures showing that I completely filled it with fluid and another three pictures showing it remained dry. Ruling out a torn seal.

Anyone have an opinion on the pictures of the weld I showed?

larry0071

While I would rather see the weld toe of that crown reinforcement pass merge into the base material, I don't see it as being a problem from a structural standpoint. Ideally that pass would smoothly roll into the base material, but in this instant it is more a visual issue than a structural one. You can always send the picture to the guys a Dynatrac and see if they have any comments on it. Where I work, I would have to fail that weld by ASME section III/V standards, but I doubt that they are working to the nuclear pressure vessel ASME code standards over at Dynatrac :-)

Dynatrac

ktoh87, sorry this has been such a struggle for you. Leaking axle seals are a pain in the butt on a front axle. There is a lot of teardown and re-assembly to get access to them. It sounds like you may have this fixed, but here is some tech for the future. Hope it helps ktoh87 and anyone else out there.

The static leak test you performed was a good idea. Unfortunately it does not replicate the rotation of the shaft. Oil is either escaping from the lip/journal interface, or around the outside of the seal.

Silicone around the outside of the seal body is cheap insurance. Seal bodies can deform during insertion and press-in.

Dynatrac PR44F axles get a seal-housing insert pressed into the inner end of the tube. This is done to enable customers to upgrade to 35spl shafts at their convenience at a future date. It is possible, but unlikely, that oil is escaping between the OD of the seal housing and the bore machined into the tube. We use a Loctite compound and a press fit to mate the 2 pieces. If you suspect this is the case, it can be easily sealed using some silicone around the seam. It is visible and accessible where you insert the axle seal. Just clean it well, and smear some silicone around the seam.

The more likely cause is the seal to shaft journal interface. Installation damage is usually the #1 cause. The splines are sharp, the seal journal can get scored in handling, and it’s an awkward insertion due to the length of the shaft.

Seal journal condition is the #2 cause. Seal journals must be ground to a 16 finish. If the journal is too rough then oil will escape under the lip. If this is happening even a microscope may not show any lip damage, so don’t let the condition of the seal lip prevent you from further inspecting the journals. The run out of the journal is also a potential problem and hard to detect. You must indicate the journal from the CL of the U-joint (Not easy to find or hold) and the CL of the splines. Depending on who made the shaft the centers in the part (if any) may not be the true CL of rotation.

Journals can be too small or too large. Too small, and they do not have enough lip pressure to repel oil back to the sump. Too large and the lip gives way. The seal journal can also be too polished or too shiny. The lip is lubricated by tiny amounts of oil working in between the lip and the journal. Shaft journals too shiny, burns out the seal lip quickly from lack of lubrication.

There are 2 ways to inspect the journal. You can buy “finish standards” from a grinding or machine shop supply house for a few bucks and compare the finishes on your shaft against the standards. Scratching both with a fingernail does this. Its all about experience and feel. If you have neither, a better way is to use an instrument called a Profilometer. Not something that you will find outside of a well-equipped grind shop or lab facility.

A bad seal is the #3 cause. Lately we have seen brand names like Timken, CR, SKF and others re-boxing imported seals from overseas manufacturers. I find this very distressing, and almost impossible to detect. All seals are not alike. Their durability, tolerance of journal finishes, elasticity, material quality, and ability to repel oil back to the sump is the secret sauce that makes one seal great, and one seal is crap. Good seals and shafts aren’t cheap, and cheap shafts and seals aren’t good. That said, even a domestic, well made part can be defective. It just happens way less often.

ktoth87

Time will tell if she leaks. I appreciate the concern over the issue. I bought a dynatrac due to the reputation and I've had continuous problems. I know dynatrac did not package the housing but when it showed up it was falling off the pallet. It was all scratched and dinged up and I had to touch up certain areas. Hardly a thing to make a deal over but when your spending this kind of money you want to scratch that up yourself and on top of the other issues( the leak and the weld) I'm not happy. I planned on buying a trail 60 in the rear to match. I'm sorry to say that the overall experience I have had I wished I bought from another company. I like the overall design on the housing but I'm staying with my opinion that for the money and hassle that I've had I could've done better. I wish I could say I would recommend dynatrac. But I will not and will not buy another product.

Dynatrac

Of course we are very sorry you will you will focus on other options in the future. If you change your mind, we would appreciate an opportunity to serve you directly next time so you can have a complete Dynatrac solution, including Dynatrac axle shafts, assembly and crating.

Whatever option you choose in the future, we wish you the very best, and hope you find what you are looking for.

ktoth87

Good news, I've driven about 250 miles and had the jeep flexed on my lift for roughly half hour each side and no leaks. So everyone can be their own judge if you have this issue. I can say I used cheap oreillys seals, cleaned the old silicone out and DID NOT use silicone and nice and dry.

The weld Im still waiting to be addressed. Is it a problem now no. But I am concerned that' it will slowly become a problem and be a problem once it's out of warranty. And have a large paperweight

larry0071

Very doubtful. But what do I know, I'm just a lowly ASNT NDE Level III weld inspector at a nuclear plant