Hi all, new here/lurker. Could really use the expertise and experience you guys have.

I am doing my first major mod on my 2016 JK Rubicon Unlimited. I have wanted to move to a 33" tire from my 32's and do a small lift, and found a shop (AllPro in Lansing, Michigan) who do 80% of their work on Jeeps and have great Google reviews. I immediately got talked into a kit that they say they do on the vast majority of Jeeps doing a suspension lift, and need you guy to check me, as the total installed cost is 5k.


I have 70k miles on my Rubi. And I have about 25-30k on my 255/75/R17 BFG K02's. Still lots of tread, but I was an idiot and missed my last tire rotation and might even be 12k late - dumb. All is good other than a vibration feeling at fast highway speeds of 80mph. And stock suspension otherwise is good, other than an unsteady chattery feeling going over high frequency bad pavement/bumps at higher speeds. A bit of an unsettling feeling, but not super common. Maybe a rotation and balancing fixes it - but I want bigger tires anyway, but *could* wait. My shocks show a fair bit of rust, but I don't see any oil leakage.

Anyway, I walked into this shop yesterday and stated the above. No visual inspection from the main guy on tires or shocks, which I kind of wondered about after. I showed him a Terraflex 1.5 lift with Falcon shocks on extreme terrain, and he immediately said "Crap Japanese stuff", and company bought out, etc. etc, and that the Falcon (2.1) shocks would be way harder than I think.

He went into his most common build, and that involves what looks to be a quality 2" Rusty's lift kit. It comes with Rusty's RX800 shocks, and what appear to be high quality springs, track bars, sway bar links, a tie rod kit (not sure if separate at the moment), links, etc.

He immediately also recommended 33" 12.50 17 Ridge Grapplers. And went on and on about how good the lift kit and tires were, and showed me his tricked out Gladiator outside set up with much of this stuff. He said the shocks would be a bit stiffer than factory, but ride nicely road and trail and give me a more positive feel, but I could step down to the RX100 shocks to go softer if I wanted (only a couple hunge cheaper). We added in 1.5" tire spacers to widen the stance of the Jeep. And I was kind of excited about how it would turn out, and he seemed to really know his stuff. We chatted a while, and I ended up going ahead and placing the order.


Well, I hadn't done more than beginning research, and was looking to take informed advice at this off-road shop, but last night I was online looking at the parts themselves, and reading tire reviews (and basic stuff on size and width choice) and info on lifts. And I came across a lot of info on sites and forums that immediately had me thinking I was an idiot and really rushing this. And read conflicting opinions on the Ridge Grapplers, and really positive ones across the board for my K02's.

This is a daily driver for me. I do want to start trailing it up in Northern Michigan, but nothing too serious - and rarely, and certainly no rocking or crawling. I have my own property with trails and a usually wet farm field, but I have a ranger for that most of the time.

So...so many questions...

Tires:
- Outside brand choice, I read about width choice and some user experience. And I saw a lot of people caution against 11.5 or 12.5 tire widths for snow and mud...but most importantly for simple rain conditions. I learned about "float" on wider tires, and that while they look cool, a more slender tire cuts better in mud and snow and may plant better in the wet. Some people even talking about aquaplaning at slower speeds with a wide tire - at like 50mph on country roads with well worn in tire grooves or something. When I called him this morning, he said that was all kind of hogwash, and he has the wide RG's on his wife's Jeep and no issues. But I am in Michigan, and I have concerns over this. Can I just take his word after what I have read online?
- Then there's the extra weight and friction leading to reduced MPG. He said it would be a negligible effect, like 1%. I don't know what to believe. That sounds like an impossibly slow effect.
- I worried also about ride quality, wear, noise. But not a lot as online opinions seem to be ok about this.
- I have 4.10 gearing, btw. Does that help me with a heavier tire?

Lift kit:
- honestly can't find a lot of info on Rusty's products. I did find a YouTube video and the parts all looked beefy, heavy and high quality.
- I do wonder how it will look lifted 2" with 33" tires, and was pouring over forum photos. I am a 4-door Rubi Unlimited, but don't run heavy bumpers or winches to weigh down the lift. He said I'd probably be looking at just over a 2" real world lift.
- I have no way of telling just how the springs and RX800 shocks will be. Like he said, it will feel firmer, and maybe a little firmer than original stock, but that my comparison will be tainted by aging shocks and my ride being not as good as it was off the lot, and it might be hard for me to see the change over so much time, and that I might initially feel the new ride would feel harsher.

Spacers:
- a 12.5" tire would gain on both sides of my current 10.5. I do think a wider stance looks "cool". But am I stupid to space them after already gaining on tire width to begin with? Is part of the spacing to get me more offset and back spacing? (Sorry, overwhelmed with info at the moment). I do like form, but want function, and I don't want a crazy looking off road Jeep. Again, daily driver.


Anyway, again, I called this morning and went through this stuff. The guy was allaying my fears on it all. He did say he only wants to do what I feel good about and want. But he seemed to dismiss all the concerns I brought up. And for such a big investment, I found it a little bit off-putting. But again, he said he only wants to do what I want, and while he thinks I am going over-board, it's good to be analytic. So I am basically in a research phase now, but the parts have shipped. I would be looking at a 5% restocking fee on the lift kit and tires because of shipping costs that would otherwise hit his shop.

Some help would be soooo appreciated. I know it is a lot, and I may have left out stuff or there are probably a lot of things I don't know about and should know.

Appreciate the help!

And here is a pic of my JK currently...

https://imgur.com/gallery/evIwHH1

 

I won't address all points, but I think I'd look at the restock fee and run. Rusty's isn't a popular choice here because there are better options IMO. The BFG all terrains are a tried and true tire- I put 50k miles on mine and still had plenty of rubber when I sold them. Never had issues in the rain but I do understand that the narrower tires will get better bite in the rain and snow.

Maybe he can apply your $250 toward the wheel spacers (should be $200 plus tax)? $5k is a lot for all of that though. I think I paid right at $1000 for tires (in a larger size, but BFG ko2's nonetheless). Lift kit was pieced together but I think you can be in a similar boat for $2500...but you really don't "need" a full lift for 33's.

Sharp looking jeep though, I'd like to see where it goes when you're ready to put parts on it. Welcome to the forum!

 

My biggest piece of advice is to be very careful about who you choose to believe and take advice from. A shop has a vested interested in selling you things, and that motivation is going to make anything they say suspect. The forums here are a good option because you'll get differing input from people with lots of experience who's only interest is providing information, helping new people get into the hobby, and of course, talking about Jeeps!

I'm from the dry SouthWest, so I can't claim much experience with the tire width vs. weather, but if you go to a taller tire with the same stock width then the spacers might only be necessary to prevent your front tires from rubbing at a full turn. You can easily gain some additional space in your wheel wells by replacing the factory liner and fender flares with higher clearance after-market options, as the factory setup really uses up a lot more space than it really needs to. Aftermarket rims are always an option as well. Spacers are also a valid option for solving the issue, but if you do go the spacer route it's important to make sure you get a high-quality hub-centric product with only the minimum necessary thickness.

I can speak from experience on the BFG AT's. I've had them several times before, and they're a great tire. Not the best for anything hardcore... but since it sounds like you aren't planning on doing that anyway, they should suit your needs very well.

 

@karls10jk Ok, thanks for your advice. Can you recall why Rusty's is not popular? I will start hunting on here for lift options. But any recommendations or specific links for info would be awesome. And I think I will stick with BFG K02's like you mentioned - I know how well they work and ride. I have read such a split on RG's. And nothing but praise for the K02's as a daily driver tire. I will update you with pics!

@RedRubycon Yes, I hear you. The guy did really just jump into those specifics, and provided me no other possibilities. Just said "this is what we do on 80% of our Jeeps. He told me of his background of working on drag racers and trucks all his life, and all the Jeep work he's done. So I kinda got hooked in. That he poo-pooed everything I was reading online when I called him this morning kind of bothered me. A bit of a know-it-all.

Thanks for your tips on the tires. I think I might limit myself to 285 max, and find out the max spacer I would need. I like the stock fenders and don't want to change them. Thanks for the tip on spacers! As for rims, I have 17's and like them. But I am not sure of the width, if they're 7, 7.5 etc. When I checked the specs of the Grapplers he ordered me, they required more inches (can't recall off hand). Yet this guy said they'd be fine, possibly without even knowing what mine are. He didn't barely look at my Jeep through the window.


Looking forward to lift recommendations and more info on tires and your experiences. I will start trying to dig through the forum more for relating posts! Thanks, everyone!!

 

From a quick browse at their website, the most expensive 2" kit, with all of the available addons, (RC800s, brakelines, and the more expensive stabilizer) comes out to $2163. I imagine that the shop is a preferred vendor, so they buy at a discount from that 2163 price? 5000 - 2163 = $2837. So, including whatever their mfg kickback is, they are charging somewhere around three grand to install a 2" bolt-on lift kit? I don't suppose that tires, rims and spacers were included in that quote - and you simply forgot to mention it?

Did you notice that the kit includes front Radius Arms? You may want to get a bit more info on those, as most of us run the more standard upper/lower arms.

 

@nthinuf The tires (5 of them) were $1800 and included. $200 for spacers. I am not sure of the nitty gritty on details on those arms in the package he put together. He scribbled down general shit. Also a dummy for not looking into EXACTLY what all was included.

 

Wider tires are better for snow and mud, skinny tires for ice. You want to stay on top of snow and mud, not cut thru it. A 11.5. or 12.5 is fine. You need the wheel spacers for tire clearance up front to maintain full steering not for a "wider stance" Your gearing is fine for a 33" tire as it is only about 1/2" bigger than stock. As for the tires stay away from a 10 ply or E rated tire for a better ride and better aired down performance. Teraflex is not Japaness junk, it Chineese Junk and I don't ever recall them getting bought out. The Falcon shocks are US made but are way over rated. Rusty's is not popular because they don't really do any marketing and they use to use a weak joint design. Looks like they hare using a better control arm joint today at least with the flex joint. The radius front arms are not a populare way to go either as that set up puts a lot of bind on the axle when flexing. If I were to do the rusty's lift it would be the 2" plus kit at $899 but it needs some more stuff with it like sway bar links and bump stops to get it set up right.

 

@TheDirtman Wow thanks a lot for that detailed feedback and info. I think I will stick with 11.5 tires. I might look at new wheels with an offset for more backspacing. The current ones I am looking at are 4.5" backspacing with a 12mm offset. I think that is enough for a 285/75/17? They are also 17 x 9 wheels - I am not sure what my stock ones are width wise. But maybe this is good also for going with the larger tire? I will also try to stay away from E!

Great feedback on the shocks/lifts. Thanks so much for looking at the Rusty's for me. I am going to call the shop this morning and ask them to email me a detailed breakdown of exactly what is in the kit. I know he added stuff. Would absolutely love your feedback on all that....

 

Stock wheels are 17x7.5", 6.25" backspace if I'm recalling correctly.

 

I'm even confused now...jus go to a Chrysler dealer, and have them do a Mopar lift for 2.5".
And call it a day!!