MotoJeeper

You can thank the "Great" state of California for that one, with their stupid CARB BS. That and making guys wait months for their 2017 Husqvarna 701 Supermotos while they go under EPA testing. That guy that happened to lived in Oregon too lol

Four Low

Trump has vowed to "roll back EPA " , will California sue to maintain rigorous standards ?
Does this mean Diesels will make a comeback ? ESS now "unnecessary "?
In 4 years time, all could go back to strict rules too.
The main driver of fuel efficiency is COST OF FUEL. The "market" drives innovation.

Spank

I'm more inclined to believe the JL will get the SelecTerrain dial simply because the Wrangler has always gotten "parts bin" leftovers from the Grand Cherokee. On top of the Pentastar and the WA850, the JK also got the rearview mirror, seats, and HVAC controls that had already been in the GC for a few years slowly after they redesigned the interior. The TJ was the same way, too.

The Active Drive 4WD system that's in every other Jeep actually kicks ass. The only concern is FCA's continued lackluster quality. A lot of modern vehicles have dials and buttons and switches that replace mechanical components and they work just fine and stand the test of time. FCA technology, on the other hand, does not.

The JL is going to kick ass. I'm excited to see the improvements and innovations to the JK. I just can't see a JL lasting as long as a TJ or even a JK without some serious maintenance.

larry0071

I have the 2016 Cherokee Trailhawk with the Pentastar and ESS (Elcronic Start/Stop). Some owners HATE it, I don't mind it at all. When you select any off-road setting on the select track system, the ESS does not function. For those that hate the system, there is a plunger switch added to the vehicles with ESS that monitors the hood open/close position... unplug that plunger and your ESS is forever disabled.

The only time you would hate it would be if you are a "hot rod" driver and need to release the brake and quickly stab the throttle. If your driving like an average human the engine started before you ever get to the throttle and you don't really notice it. I also have a 2013 Malibu 2SA hybrid with start/stop, and the Malibu engine is so smooth that you don't feel it shut off or re-start. The Pentastar is not nearly the same quality of engine as the I4 in the Malibu, so you very much feel it go silent (no more shaking the vehicle) and you very much feel it re-start. After about a week of living with ESS you start to not notice it, and when you get in a car that is wasting gas at a red light... it bothers you. You also learn how to partially lift the brake to pre-start the engine if you do want o hot rod away from the red light. You also learn how to stop without triggering it by not bearing in the brake peddle. You can stop at a stop-sign without it shutting off once you learn the mechanics/feel of the brake peddle switch.

It's not nearly as bad as you folks are thinking, or your really not that in tune with your vehicle and never learned to control it. I made friends with it (the ESS) on my Trailhawk and we get along just fine.

Four Low

Part of the dislike for the ESS system is that it adds a layer of complexity to an off road vehicle ; the additional sensors , software are liabilities that could be expensive to replace in the future.
Comparing your Cherokee to a JK is comparing apples to oranges.
My concern is off road, hard use Durability, not your Urban Back-Patting driving from light to light.

larry0071

You missed the point. The system is disabled if select track is used. Someone posted earlier that they could see select track going to the new Wrangler as a GC hand me down, and that ESS is coming, and that they would hate ESS while off-road. I was explaining that all of this is assembled and in use on the Cherokee TH and Jeep removes ESS from the vehicle during off road use. I agree that a Cherokee is a sad joke off road compared to even a stock Sport, so you'll not bait me into taking insult there. I bought it because we wanted a nice AWD station wagon for family use. The Cherokee is actually a really nice station wagon, and the 4x4 system works amazing on snow covered roads. For a daily driver, all wheel drive, family camping/grocery hauling wagon.... you can't ask for more. I love the Cherokee for it's assigned role at our house. And the ESS is not something that is a deal breaker, it's just a simple little system added to save a few %%% of MPG so as to help FCA keep the Wrangler alive.

Four Low

Thank you for Proving my point.

Smudgeontheglass

I feel like if you're a JK owner who modifies their vehicle for off-road you are okay with all the extra sensors. Mandated safety equipment like stability control and now reverse cameras add to complexity and future problems but are not the only issue here. On a JK dash, everything is run by wires. Even the automatic shifts via electronics and solenoids.

I remember reading recently of a 2008 model year F150 that had a failure in the HVAC control panel. The owner learned that not only were there no replacement parts available, they were not even manufactured anymore. A less than 10 year old vehicle that lost a critical piece of equipment and its now garbage. To be fair that ended with a lawsuit and Ford manufacturing a parts run. But the same thing happens. Modern cars are complex, expensive and completely outdated in a couple years.

shabbernigdo

you shouldent need to learn a bunch of extra bs just to drive your vehicle the way you want to not to mention the unessary added complexity to a vehicle thats already got too many electronic bits IMO.

OverKill

How does that ESS work when you slam on the brake, to like avoid something (deer, vehicle, etc)? Does it shut off and the steering turns into arm strong steering? Not a real big fan of something like that, but then I don't need a computer to tell me my tire is low, I learned how to check tire pressure; I don't need a back up camera, I learned to be aware who & what is outside when I leave, check all mirrors, turn around and look, check to see where everybody is before putting in reverse, in the Army it is called situational awareness (know where you are and everybody else in relationship to you). Just don't need all the sensors and computers.