A "Heads Up" to CB'ers....
JK Newbie
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 38
Likes: 0
From: Denver, CO
First off, AK4Dave lives on the Kenai Peninsula, in Alaska, and has a considerably different environment and communications requirement than most of you who have responded to his post and live in the "southeast" of the lower 48 states. Secondly, he took time to alert the rest of us on the JK board that, like it or not, our CBs may well be affected by Sun Spot Cycle 24. This is a hard core fact that I have had experience with in the past. Thank you Dave.
And lastly, Dave provided an option to CB, the HAM radio system, that if used could preclude communications interruptions that the CB frequency band may suffer during intense periods of sun spot activity. Like it or not, all of the data in Dave's post provided useful information and a solid alternative solution. "Good on ya' Dave."
JackMac4 mentioned the GMRS/FRS radios as an option. Well, the GMRS radios also requires a FCC license but I can't remember anyone I know every getting one. I carry and use two Motorola T7450 Talkabout radios in my Jeep at all times. Their performance is no better, and in some cases is worse than my Cobra 75 CB. The GMRS is an alternative to the CB, but offers no improvement in capabilities for Jeepers on the trail.
The HAM radio option does offer considerably improved range and mode capabilities when compared to the garden variety CB of even a SSB CB. It then becomes a cost trade off analysis to see how much in the way of improved capabilities you can afford. Like the CB or GMRS radios, the HAM VHF radios are line of sight and are hindered by the same environmental restrictions like trying to talk from a valley or canyon. The HAM VHF radios generally have more power out than a CB or GMRS. On the other hand, HAM HF (High Frequency) radios generate sky waves which have the ability to transmit almost anywhere in the world if that blows your skirt up. Bottom line, HAM radio options do offer much improved capabilities over a CB. How much are you willing to pay from them?
And lastly, Dave provided an option to CB, the HAM radio system, that if used could preclude communications interruptions that the CB frequency band may suffer during intense periods of sun spot activity. Like it or not, all of the data in Dave's post provided useful information and a solid alternative solution. "Good on ya' Dave."
JackMac4 mentioned the GMRS/FRS radios as an option. Well, the GMRS radios also requires a FCC license but I can't remember anyone I know every getting one. I carry and use two Motorola T7450 Talkabout radios in my Jeep at all times. Their performance is no better, and in some cases is worse than my Cobra 75 CB. The GMRS is an alternative to the CB, but offers no improvement in capabilities for Jeepers on the trail.
The HAM radio option does offer considerably improved range and mode capabilities when compared to the garden variety CB of even a SSB CB. It then becomes a cost trade off analysis to see how much in the way of improved capabilities you can afford. Like the CB or GMRS radios, the HAM VHF radios are line of sight and are hindered by the same environmental restrictions like trying to talk from a valley or canyon. The HAM VHF radios generally have more power out than a CB or GMRS. On the other hand, HAM HF (High Frequency) radios generate sky waves which have the ability to transmit almost anywhere in the world if that blows your skirt up. Bottom line, HAM radio options do offer much improved capabilities over a CB. How much are you willing to pay from them?
That said, if you dont have the interest or see the need. Skip over this piece of gear and buy new fog lights instead. CB's work fine for convoys and chatting between cars.
Thread Starter
JK Jedi
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 5,813
Likes: 0
From: Kenai Peninsula, Alaska
Well said. I go out to the desert in southern Utah and my CB is routinely out of range of anyone I can contact for help. I am in the process of getting a HAM license and I would recommend everyone to do the same if you are ever in serious backcountry situations. Plus even if you only use it once, lets say to get a FlightForLife chopper in for a buddy who is having a heart attack, stroke, serious head injury, broken bones etc. you will be glad you have it. If people are willing to spend 1k on new speakers, I can easily justify $300 on a decent HAM radio.
That said, if you dont have the interest or see the need. Skip over this piece of gear and buy new fog lights instead. CB's work fine for convoys and chatting between cars.
That said, if you dont have the interest or see the need. Skip over this piece of gear and buy new fog lights instead. CB's work fine for convoys and chatting between cars.
JK Freak
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 596
Likes: 0
From: Menifee,CA
WOW,I was just thinking about geting a CB and still probaly will.Do to the fact of getting licenced for HAM and how much I would even use it,
i,ve been reading posts on this thread for an hour and my head is spining
in circles.
I don't know about any of this stuff. Dose any one have an idea what would be a good CB set up for my JK..... I was looking at some cobra models in one of my jeep catologes......any advice?
i,ve been reading posts on this thread for an hour and my head is spining in circles.I don't know about any of this stuff. Dose any one have an idea what would be a good CB set up for my JK..... I was looking at some cobra models in one of my jeep catologes......any advice?
JK Newbie
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 86
Likes: 0
From: Las Vegas, Nevada
I know I'm way late in this conversation and if may have been said already, but somebody mentioned needing a FCC license to operate a GMRS. Well, anyone using a radio over 1 watt is required to have a FCC license. I'm sure no one has one but it don't know why it would be a big deal for using GMRS.
JK Enthusiast
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 268
Likes: 2
From: Tucson
Good thread.
For the most part, the CB only - GMRS/FRS folks have a viable point. Why go through all the trouble to get a Ham ticket if you're just using your radio for trail runs? CB's work just fine, they're relatively inexpensive and fairly easy to install.
The one option for Ham radio's, that isn’t often considered, deals with the dual-band aspect of the modern amateur VHF/UHF transceivers. When the group I regularly travel with sets up a run, the "Trail Boss" (the rig leading the pack) is always on a different band than those following.
Thus, all the rigs on the run have dual band (UHF/VHF) radios. These radios are capable of transmitting and receiving on either band at the same time. The Trail Boss is transmitting on UHF, while the rest of the group is transmitting on VHF. The VHF group can chat with one another, and the Trail Boss can also hear them. However, when the Trail Boss needs to inform the folks in the pack that there's an obstacle, in-coming, or potential hazard on the trail, he can be heard by all those following, regardless of anyone chatting on VHF.
It's just an additional safety issue that's worth informing the general off-roading community about. Of course, the likelihood of all the rigs in any particular group having the dual-band radios is fairly low. And, the CB community could adapt, to some degree, by having a CB and an FRS radio in each rig.
Safety on the trail is in everybody's best interest.
For the most part, the CB only - GMRS/FRS folks have a viable point. Why go through all the trouble to get a Ham ticket if you're just using your radio for trail runs? CB's work just fine, they're relatively inexpensive and fairly easy to install.
The one option for Ham radio's, that isn’t often considered, deals with the dual-band aspect of the modern amateur VHF/UHF transceivers. When the group I regularly travel with sets up a run, the "Trail Boss" (the rig leading the pack) is always on a different band than those following.
Thus, all the rigs on the run have dual band (UHF/VHF) radios. These radios are capable of transmitting and receiving on either band at the same time. The Trail Boss is transmitting on UHF, while the rest of the group is transmitting on VHF. The VHF group can chat with one another, and the Trail Boss can also hear them. However, when the Trail Boss needs to inform the folks in the pack that there's an obstacle, in-coming, or potential hazard on the trail, he can be heard by all those following, regardless of anyone chatting on VHF.
It's just an additional safety issue that's worth informing the general off-roading community about. Of course, the likelihood of all the rigs in any particular group having the dual-band radios is fairly low. And, the CB community could adapt, to some degree, by having a CB and an FRS radio in each rig.
Safety on the trail is in everybody's best interest.
Thread Starter
JK Jedi
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 5,813
Likes: 0
From: Kenai Peninsula, Alaska
Just to reiterate...
Right now, the only reason CBers are able to communicate with each other over just a couple miles, is because of the poor sunspot activity at this time in the solar cycle. For some reason the sun just hasn't been behaving the way it was predicted to do. "Experts" have said that it has gone from being the best cycle (as far as long range communications are concerned) in history, to possibly being the worst. Normally, during this time in the cycle the sunspots would be so active that a CBer would be hard pressed to be able to talk over a mile away. Reason being is that there will be so much "hash and trash" saturating the CB band coming in from all over the world that you just can't get a little 4 watt signal through it all. It's not that it isn't getting out there, but that it is being stomped by thousands of high powered signals all coming in at one time.
You are probably wondering what does he mean.....didn't he say "as far as long range communications are concerned". Yes I did. And yes, your little 4 watt signal does have the potential to be able to talk to another station in say, China...but only in a perfect world and on a "QUIET" band. But this would be do to, what a lot of you call "skywave" communications or "skip", where your signal bounces off the different layers of atmosphere and can end up in another part of the world. But for the most part when it comes to CB coms it is all a matter of local ground wave activity, and this is where the problem is. If the sun was active a little 4 watt signal just can't get out over a solid S9 (almost full scale reading on your meter) saturation of noise.
I understand that most of you only need the CB to talk to your buddy on the trail. And that's fine. That's what it's good for. I think I read that some of you have been talking upwards of 15 miles. But if the sun was doing it's thing like it normally would at this time, in case of an emergency where you have no cell phone coverage either, nobody would be able to hear you on your CB any farther than probably a mile away.
I haven't been very active on my HAM radio very much at all this past year. So I haven't been up on the day to day propagation. I have to ask, have any of you turned on your radio and heard what I'm trying to explain yet? Have you turned it on and seen your meter almost pegged with noting but noise? Many times all you'll hear is a mish-mosh of Aisian chatter as, from what I hear, many of the Aisian taxis run high power CBs.
Believe me.....if, and when, the sun does kick in, when this happens as soon as you turn on your radio you'll know exactly what I'm talking about. But until then most of you have no idea. It's a pretty amazing phenomenon to say the least....
Right now, the only reason CBers are able to communicate with each other over just a couple miles, is because of the poor sunspot activity at this time in the solar cycle. For some reason the sun just hasn't been behaving the way it was predicted to do. "Experts" have said that it has gone from being the best cycle (as far as long range communications are concerned) in history, to possibly being the worst. Normally, during this time in the cycle the sunspots would be so active that a CBer would be hard pressed to be able to talk over a mile away. Reason being is that there will be so much "hash and trash" saturating the CB band coming in from all over the world that you just can't get a little 4 watt signal through it all. It's not that it isn't getting out there, but that it is being stomped by thousands of high powered signals all coming in at one time.
You are probably wondering what does he mean.....didn't he say "as far as long range communications are concerned". Yes I did. And yes, your little 4 watt signal does have the potential to be able to talk to another station in say, China...but only in a perfect world and on a "QUIET" band. But this would be do to, what a lot of you call "skywave" communications or "skip", where your signal bounces off the different layers of atmosphere and can end up in another part of the world. But for the most part when it comes to CB coms it is all a matter of local ground wave activity, and this is where the problem is. If the sun was active a little 4 watt signal just can't get out over a solid S9 (almost full scale reading on your meter) saturation of noise.
I understand that most of you only need the CB to talk to your buddy on the trail. And that's fine. That's what it's good for. I think I read that some of you have been talking upwards of 15 miles. But if the sun was doing it's thing like it normally would at this time, in case of an emergency where you have no cell phone coverage either, nobody would be able to hear you on your CB any farther than probably a mile away.
I haven't been very active on my HAM radio very much at all this past year. So I haven't been up on the day to day propagation. I have to ask, have any of you turned on your radio and heard what I'm trying to explain yet? Have you turned it on and seen your meter almost pegged with noting but noise? Many times all you'll hear is a mish-mosh of Aisian chatter as, from what I hear, many of the Aisian taxis run high power CBs.
Believe me.....if, and when, the sun does kick in, when this happens as soon as you turn on your radio you'll know exactly what I'm talking about. But until then most of you have no idea. It's a pretty amazing phenomenon to say the least....
JK Newbie
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 16
Likes: 0
From: Lead SD
I am a trail guide for Jeep Jamboree for the past 15 years We run 4 to 5 trails at a time. Each trail runs on a different CB channel. However, the Trail Guides use 2m Ham rigs also so that we can talk between all the trails. The CB's have no chance of reaching the other trails. Ham Radio lets up communicate on the timing of each trail, any breakdowns, emergencies, or just to chat as we are wheelin. As Dave said, Cb's have there place, but it sure is nice to be able to communicate a fair distance away when there is no cell service and a CB just won't reach. So we use both.
73
KD0JLU
73
KD0JLU