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Jeep Offroading Death

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Old 08-09-2009 | 03:45 AM
  #11  
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Sad but familiar. We have a few tourist deaths in the outback each year here (as well as being eaten by crocs or kidnapped by crazed psychos) from folks who hire a 4WD, drive off into the desert and get stuck. Some have been found with a vehicle that was eventually driven out easily by just airing down a bit.
Ignoring the golden rules of heeding local advice on track and weather conditions, taking recovery gear, not travelling alone, hiring a HF radio/satphone or EPIRB and never leaving the vicinity of the stranded vehicle is asking for trouble . Not enough water is a killer. Simple tricks like draining some fuel and starting a smoky signal fire, signalling aircraft with a shiny CD and placing clothing/ gear in a large X or H pattern should be remembered, too.
Maybe the woman was already dehydrated and delirious when she abandoned the wheel and just plain not thinking straight. Panic often sets in early when lost.
Old 08-10-2009 | 04:45 AM
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And another story i have heard about death valley, is that someone broke down, walk to the town ( ithink it's like 15 miles ) got himself the parts needed to repair the car, and died on his way back to the car. How stupid is this?
Old 08-10-2009 | 10:29 AM
  #13  
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Originally Posted by Area-51
Doesn't sound like they were totally unprepared, they did have 24 16 oz bottles of water and some food.
By way of reference, my son is a Marine who spent some time in Iraq recently. It sounds like similar conditions. When patrolling, he said he went through 17 to 19 Camelbacks of water a day just to stay hydrated.

Phil
Old 08-10-2009 | 06:27 PM
  #14  
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Originally Posted by MarcusRTJ
Wow man thats crazy. I wonder if there was foul play...how the hell does a small DOG survive but a boy doesn't?

Doesn't seem right to me one way or another.

Sad yes, but come on. Don't play with fire, you'll get burned.
Quite odd, I think. The mom is a nurse. She can keep herself and dog alive but not her son? Foul play is my vote. The Panamint Valley trip is a cover story for what really happened to the boy. My wife and I would give our own lives to save our son...but nurse/mom didn't?

Regardless, if you get a chance, check out the Panamint Valley and its trails, in November, with a group...it is awesome!
Old 08-11-2009 | 12:34 PM
  #15  
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And it all goes back to basic prep -- It took too long to find them because nobody knew where to look. Even though they did apparently tell people of their intentions, they didn't stick to them. As for the GPS, it's not wrong to rely on it, but to turn off the road to follow it may not have been the smartest move.

And face it, had this happened in Missouri, they would have been late back to work and a bit hungry. Everything gets compounded when you're in a hostile landscape.

By the way, the dog was supposedly a dachsund, a breed which is actually reasonably well adapted to survival in heat and with little water.

There's really only one truly sad aspect of this story -- Almost everyone has started out the same way, but just didn't get into trouble. I'll bet every one of us has plenty of trips that they didn't prepare for, but that went just fine due to luck or circumstances or phases of the moon.

Jeff

Last edited by jeff@zina.com; 08-11-2009 at 12:36 PM.
Old 08-11-2009 | 02:39 PM
  #16  
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very interesting if you ask me... and why would you ever turn off of the road?
Old 08-11-2009 | 03:54 PM
  #17  
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Originally Posted by Winyah
I read this morning that the mom is blaming the gps.
I work with GPS on a day-to-day basis as well as use them extensively with my Boy Scout Troop. If the maps aren't updated regularly then they will not be accurate. If it's strictly an auto type and has no way of uploading topo maps, then using it in the backcountry is useless. The GPS probably did exactly what she wanted it to do. It routed her where she wanted to go. Just not the most highway friendly route.

I once went on a backpacking trip and marked the location of the trailhead. No problems. When we went back a year later, we decided to backpack a trail just below the previous one. Since I knew that the trailhead from last year's trip was just a mile up the road, I didn't mark a waypoint. When it was time to leave, I told the GPS to reverse my route back home. Well, that's exactly what it did. I was talking and not paying attention and the thing took us all around the entire mountain and back to the trailhead that we had hiked the previous year. It then gave me directions home. Only added about 45 minutes and 14 miles of gravel roads to the trip but it did exactly what I asked it to do.

The point is: GPS are great tools but if they tell you to go somewhere and you get that gut feeling that it doesn't feel right. Stop and re-evaluate. I feel extremely bad for the family but too many people rely 100% on their technology and forget the basics of common sense.

It's like those hikers you read about on Monday mornings. They went on a little hike without a compass, water, food, or map. Guess what? They got lost. Had to send out the National Guard to locate them. I tell my boys all the time. Never go into the backcountry without a compass and a topo map. And if you're going to use a topo map and compass, make sure you know how to use and read them.
Old 08-12-2009 | 07:21 AM
  #18  
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Hi Guys n Girls,

Rock crawling and mud I have only amateur hour experience but out here in the Sandbox the Empty Quarter is my playground.

Now I am as sorry as anyone about this lady losing her son but like it or not this lady has Darwin award written all over her.

That said I am Canadian and something like this would appear to be more probable in Canada or Oz so I am surprised that loss of life can still happen from getting lost on an relatively local (ie less than twenty miles from a road) situation in the lower 48 states.

I have extensive desert experience with the majority of it dune bashing in the Shah area between Liwa Oasis and the Saudi border in the Empty Quarter.

It seems from year to year out here some family or group ends up getting lost in the desert. It is amazing but usually they are not deep in the Empty Quarter but like this lady within 20 kilometers of a road. More than a few have been within 5 or 6 kilometers from a road.

The last incident I remember is four engineers from the Ukraine in Ras Al Khamah went into the desert in a single Toyota Land Cruiser and ended up stuck and all four tried to walk out and only one survived. There are a few posters on these forums from Ras Al Khamah and Dubai (I am in Abu Dhabi) that might have more details on this case regarding Ukraine engineers but I believe they were within a few kilometers of the road.

I carry a hand held GPS instead of one attached or built into my Jeep since I also use it for hiking etc. A few years ago I lost my GPS in the sand when I rolled my TJ coming too fast out of a bowel with a hidden dune face on the other side (stupid over confident driver error). However I was out with two other cars which each had a GPS. I also never go out without my Silva compass which I wear around my neck in my front shirt pocket and never leave it in the Jeep. I also knew the area and exactly where the nearest camel camp was and could have walked out easily or signaled them with fire etc. Insead with my mates I drove out without a roof which was tore off in the roll.

As was pointed out above by some other posters this woman really made just about every mistake in the book.

First off you always take enough water to float a battle ship. With survival rationing I could stay alive for weeks in the Empty Quarter in the summer with the amount of water I carry. I also carry rubber mats and aluminum ladders in case I get really stuck and have to use my high lift to jack up and put them under the tires for traction etc in soft sand.

The main rule is never ever go into the desert alone.

Now to be honest I break this rule more than I like to admit to anyone but besides all the water, rubber mats, aluminum ladders I have a winch and a sand anchor to attaché the winch to which is a sand specific variation on the Pull Pall you see in the USA.

It isn’t smart and I am not trying to justify it as any thing more than personal choice but even solo I am pretty well equipped to get myself out of 99.99% of the situations you find dune bashing in the biggest dunes in the biggest sand desert on the planet.

It does appear than this woman was uneducated, naïve, way over confident with it all topped off by being completely devoid of common sense along with burying the needle on the stupid meter.

And nature ended up making her pay a horrible price for all of the above.

Stupid or not it is a horrible story that will haunt a parent forever.

Regards to all, Liwa Oasis

PS Another classic death trap out here is the silly family camping in a wadi and then half of them drown when a flash flood takes out the campsite in the middle of the night.
Old 08-12-2009 | 12:36 PM
  #19  
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they had ample water for the trip. Also you'd think what they brought food wise would also work for what was needed. But one thing that is pretty ironic is that the little weenie dog made it out okay. I have one of those things at home. He's the most spoiled dog ever. His climate is A/C and can't stand the rain...

All & all sad story but at least some good came of it. They found her & The dog alive rather then a jeep full of bodies.
Old 08-12-2009 | 04:16 PM
  #20  
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Tragic, yes. Mostly because it was avoidable.

There's nothing wrong with going alone (and quite a bit right about it), as long as you are fully aware of the risks and hazards, prepared for when things don't go as planned, and accept the risks. I've been exploring all over the west alone for years, including a couple weeks in Death Valley near where this incident took place. It's an unforgiving, beautiful place, and huge. You can't just throw a few things in a car and go for it, especially in a place like DV. Being adequately prepared for trips like that first requires that you are willing and able to look reality in the eye, consider the real risks, and take every reasonable measure to prepare for them. Most folks have a problem thinking about 'scary' stuff like that, they don't like to consider that something bad could happen, so they bury their heads in the sand, cross their fingers, and hope for the best. Sometimes it works. Sometimes not so well.

People rely too much on technology they do not understand. The technology is there, but it's advancing faster than they can produce a truly user-friendly version of it. My GF routinely gets lost relying on her GPS instead of a map. Most of those devices, especially the navigator type you find in a lot of vehicles these days, are helpful in some settings, but a lousy substitute for basic understanding of map and land navigation.

Not sure who said it, but it's one of my favorite quotes: "The map is not the territory."


Instead of a GPS, she should have had a Spot satellite messenger. These things are great, easy to use, and will save a lot of lives.

Last edited by dustdriver; 08-12-2009 at 04:19 PM.


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