Notices
Modified JK Tech Tech related bulletin board forum regarding subjects such as suspension, tires & wheels, steering, bumpers, skid plates, drive train, cages, on-board air and other useful modifications that will help improve the performance and protection of your Jeep JK Wrangler (Rubicon, Sahara, Unlimited and X) on the trail.

PLEASE DO NOT START SHOW & TELL TYPE THREADS IN THIS FORUM

Front wobble after OME install

Thread Tools
 
Old Dec 18, 2008 | 11:34 AM
  #1  
techpimp's Avatar
Thread Starter
JK Newbie
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 37
Likes: 0
From: Orlando, FL
Unhappy Front wobble after OME install

I recently installed the 2" OME lift + front and rear adjustable track bars on my 2 door '07 JK. I am still running stock tires and will have to put up with them for at least a couple more months.

Following the lift I had a balance and alignment done.

Unfortunately my experience following the lift has been far from the clandestine testimonials from others who have gotten the OME :( … I was having frequent issues with 'death wobble' until I installed a cam bolt kit to allow my caster to be adjusted.
After adjustment back to factory spec full-on 'death wobble' no longer occurred, but a slight controllable wobble remains whenever I hit a bump... kind of like it hints at wanting to death wobble but isn’t quite bad enough to go thru with it.

My last trip to an alignment shop provided the following specs on the front:
L R
------------------------
Caster 3.9 4.3
Camber -0.6 -0.3
Toe -0.10 0.35

I should also volunteer I had my tires re-balanced just in case this was the cause and while they were in fact out of balance and corrected, the problem continues to occur on bumps.
Also, I am certain my axles have been re-centered (I paid the best alignment shop in Orlando to re-center them for me) and all bolts have been torgued to spec.

I am convinced the answer is in the caster angle judging by the slight improvement after increasing it, but the question is how much further does it need to go?

Has anyone experienced a similar issue? What was the magic number yours needed to resolve the problem?
Reply
Old Dec 18, 2008 | 11:46 AM
  #2  
Northridge4x4's Avatar
Sponsoring Vendor
 
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 5,892
Likes: 6
Default

None of this is because of the OME kit in my opinion. Something has to be loose or warn out and by installing the lift kit you magnified that and now feel it.

Not having the correct castor has never created a "wobble" in my experience . Flight steering yes but not a wobble. I would take a look at everything that you removed and put on to make sure it is all tight.

What trackbars do you have?

David
Reply
Old Dec 18, 2008 | 11:48 AM
  #3  
Windrocker's Avatar
JK Enthusiast
 
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 287
Likes: 0
From: Knoxville, TN
Default

A couple of questions,,,, which OME Springs did you get? I have the 616 and 618's.

How did your alignment shop recenter your axles, did you install adjustable track bars?

Mine has never been to the alignment shop, just recentered the steering wheel as instructed. Handling and ride are second to none. It makes my Mercedes feel like a log wagon.

The forum here steered me away from using cam bolts and I installed adjustable upper control arms to dial my caster to 5.8 degrees. You might check your cam bolts to make sure they are not wobbling around.

How much air are you running in the tires?
Reply
Old Dec 18, 2008 | 11:57 AM
  #4  
nclehmann's Avatar
JK Super Freak
 
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,095
Likes: 0
From: Raleigh, NC
Default

My understanding is that the caster angle should be between 7 & 8 degrees for a 3" lift. That's what WOL had when he ran his FT 3" ultimate lift. If you're running the HD springs with no after-market add-ons front or rear, I bet you're getting at least 4" of lift height from your OME kit. I'm not sure you can get 7 degrees from cam bolts - you may need adjustable control arms - at least the uppers.

Get a good set of adjustable control arms and I would consider getting a new front driveshaft if you don't plan on getting a heavy-a$$ bumper with winch to weigh down and lower your front a little. If you have an auto tranny, your front driveshaft boot is going to tear up eventually. David at Northridge 4x4 can help you. Give him a call. He's very helpful and has probably seen this problem before as he sells many OME kits.

Hope everything works out well for you. Good luck.
Reply
Old Dec 18, 2008 | 01:58 PM
  #5  
techpimp's Avatar
Thread Starter
JK Newbie
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 37
Likes: 0
From: Orlando, FL
Default

David, my track bars are JKS front (PN:OGS121) and rear (PN:OGS159).

Windrocker, the springs are 615 in front and 617 in back; all light duty. My rig is bone stock other than this lift and some 0-3" TF sway bar disconnects. I will not be putting an after-market bumper on, cutting my stock to be a stubby perhaps, but not replacing it.
I desperately want the Mercedes I do not have to also feel like a log wagon compared to my Jeep
I am running 35psi in the rear and 30psi in the front - exactly what the sticker on the inside of the door says to run stock tires at.

RuBob, I dunno what the deal is with the Toes, but I can say it sure drives nice and straight... its just when I hit a bump it wants to taunt me.

I checked all the bolts for at least the 4th time and I can’t get any turn out of them whatsoever so they have to be tight enough. I also tried giving another shake to the control arms, track bar, etc to see if there was any allowed side to side motion indicating an issue with worn bushings but there was no noticeable problem.

As a last ditch effort before breaking down and buying upper control arms I am going to get my hands on an Angle Finder to see if it there is any more caster adjustment possible out of my cam bolts. Which direction equals more caster - shortening the lower control arm or lengthening it?
Reply
Old Dec 18, 2008 | 02:09 PM
  #6  
Northridge4x4's Avatar
Sponsoring Vendor
 
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 5,892
Likes: 6
Default

HMM, Not sure what it could be to be honest.

Do this for me with your jeep in park or nuetral. Have somebody sit in the drivers seat with it running and turn the steering wheel from 10 - 2 back and forth. While they are doing these be in front of the Jeep looking at every joint , bolt ect looking for movement.

If you are getting a wobble that you were not getting before you installed the lift then something is loose. Or a tire may be out of round. The lift will not produce wobbles.

David
Reply
Old Dec 18, 2008 | 02:10 PM
  #7  
wayoflife's Avatar
JK-Forum Founder
 
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 36,534
Likes: 16
From: Laguna Niguel, CA
Default

Originally Posted by techpimp
I was having frequent issues with 'death wobble' until I installed a cam bolt kit to allow my caster to be adjusted.
so that we are absolutely clear here, "death wobble" is the extremely violent shaking of your entire jeep to the point where it feels as if it's gonna tear itself apart if you don't stop immediately. anything less than that IS NOT death wobble.

After adjustment back to factory spec full-on 'death wobble' no longer occurred, but a slight controllable wobble remains whenever I hit a bump... kind of like it hints at wanting to death wobble but isn’t quite bad enough to go thru with it.
then what you have is NOT death wobble as there is no such thing as a hint of wanting to death wobble. either you have it or you don't.

My last trip to an alignment shop provided the following specs on the front:
L R
------------------------
Caster 3.9 4.3
Camber -0.6 -0.3
Toe -0.10 0.35
am i reading your toe numbers correcly.

I should also volunteer I had my tires re-balanced just in case this was the cause and while they were in fact out of balance and corrected, the problem continues to occur on bumps.
Also, I am certain my axles have been re-centered (I paid the best alignment shop in Orlando to re-center them for me) and all bolts have been torgued to spec.
just to clarify, did you torque your bolts yourself or just trust your shop did a good job?

I am convinced the answer is in the caster angle judging by the slight improvement after increasing it, but the question is how much further does it need to go?
and you could be right. little to no caster can cause your wheels to wiggle around just like a shopping cart with a bum caster. adding more caster may help fix your problem.

Has anyone experienced a similar issue? What was the magic number yours needed to resolve the problem?
for the amount of lift you have, i would recommend +6°~7°. also, check your tire pressure and make sure that it isn't over filled. for stock 32" tires, you shouldn't be running them any higher than 30-35 psi.
Reply
Old Dec 18, 2008 | 02:13 PM
  #8  
wayoflife's Avatar
JK-Forum Founder
 
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 36,534
Likes: 16
From: Laguna Niguel, CA
Default

Originally Posted by techpimp
I checked all the bolts for at least the 4th time and I can’t get any turn out of them whatsoever so they have to be tight enough.
just because you cannot get any turn out them doesn't mean you have tightend them to spec. you NEED to put a torque wrench to your bolts and make sure that they are tightend to 125 ft. lbs. of torque with the weight of your jeep on the ground.

As a last ditch effort before breaking down and buying upper control arms I am going to get my hands on an Angle Finder to see if it there is any more caster adjustment possible out of my cam bolts. Which direction equals more caster - shortening the lower control arm or lengthening it?
you can only add more caster with adjustable control arms. unfortuantely, you installed cam bolts and so you will need to have the slots that you made in your lower control arm mounts addressed first.
Reply
Old Dec 18, 2008 | 09:05 PM
  #9  
techpimp's Avatar
Thread Starter
JK Newbie
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 37
Likes: 0
From: Orlando, FL
Default

A couple updates....

Death Wobble is back... it happened twice on the freeway this evening and yes it IS death wobble and not just a minor wobble.

I refused to attempt to drive home tonight without eliminating a couple possibilities.

First we took my buddies wheels/tires off of his JK and put them on mine to see if this fixed it and it did not thus eliminating tires as being the issue.

Second I had him turn the wheel back and forth (as suggested) and noticed a lot of bushing flex in my JKS track bar where it connects to the front axle. However this is not b/c it is loose as I have checked to ensure it is torque to 125ft lbs several times.

The current thought is it could be defective bushings in the JKS track bar. Tomorrow I am going to put the stock track bar back in and drive it around a bit to find out.

I am going to ignore the caster angle for now as I have been advised this would primarily cause issues with flighty steering of which I have not experienced. Who knows though… this wobble goes away and perhaps I’ll notice more room for improvement (shrug).

Also, I have dissected the alignment printout concluding the shop that did it to be nothing short of lazy. When they said it was all in the 'green' that is only true if you look at the totals... one toe way out and the other in when factory spec says both should be the same certainly is NOT aligned. Whenever I figure out what is causing the death wobble I plan to take the printout to another location of the same chain and have them address it.

I will keep you all updated on whether or not it ended up being the track bar bushings.

Last edited by techpimp; Dec 18, 2008 at 09:18 PM.
Reply
Old Dec 19, 2008 | 08:33 AM
  #10  
Northridge4x4's Avatar
Sponsoring Vendor
 
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 5,892
Likes: 6
Default

Second I had him turn the wheel back and forth (as suggested) and noticed a lot of bushing flex in my JKS track bar where it connects to the front axle. However this is not b/c it is loose as I have checked to ensure it is torque to 125ft lbs several times.

The bushing will deflect a little bit. It is made to do that. It is the same bushing you have in your stock trackbar.

So what do you do when you get this "death wobble" ?

David
Reply



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 02:47 PM.