JK Rubi Upgrade Question
12-29-2016, 07:11 PM
#32
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Sorry, I guess I should've included that info. I'm guessing that the tube bent at the C on the driver's side as I had about a degree of negative camber they couldn't dial out.
Last edited by japatton@icloud.com; 12-29-2016 at 07:14 PM.
12-29-2016, 07:56 PM
#33
So if in several cases if it's the tube AT the C that bends, then I can actually see why gusseting the C's would still make sense. Sure the C forgings themselves may get weaker on a molecular level as a result of the welding but the weak point is the tube attached to the C.
If that's the case, then you would still want the tube gusset'd to the C. Am I missing something here?
If that's the case, then you would still want the tube gusset'd to the C. Am I missing something here?
12-29-2016, 08:40 PM
#34
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So if in several cases if it's the tube AT the C that bends, then I can actually see why gusseting the C's would still make sense. Sure the C forgings themselves may get weaker on a molecular level as a result of the welding but the weak point is the tube attached to the C.
If that's the case, then you would still want the tube gusset'd to the C. Am I missing something here?
If that's the case, then you would still want the tube gusset'd to the C. Am I missing something here?
12-30-2016, 01:14 PM
#35
Sponsoring Manufacturer
REPOSTED INFO:
Earlier I got off the phone with a Dana Spicer engineer and this is what he said about the end forging/yolk/Inner-C and Ultimate Dana 44.
Me: “Just about everyone I talk to recommends welding on Inner-C gussets on Dana 44’s because they bend. And that the Ultimate Dana 44 looks to be the same”
Engineer: "Dana axle end forgings are not the parts that these guys are bending, it's the axle tube, specifically the long side. Anything short of a car wreck is not going to bend the end forgings. These Jeep forums and Internet blogs have been feed a lie from who knows where and are full of BS. Furthermore if you weld on the gussets they sell for the end forgings, your “Inner-C” you'll actually make it weaker because of the heat needed to weld them on changes the grain size, structure and flow imparted by the forging process, so don't do that!”
Me: “What about putting sleeves in mine?”
Engineer: “I’m not in sales and can’t tell you what to buy or do, if done properly installing sleeves will help but it’s a Band-Aid at best, a single thicker tube is far stronger. If you are going to run 35" or 37" tires and actually go off-roading with your JK I would recommend whether or not you buy the Ultimate Dana 44 from us you should upgrade your front axle. Myself and the other Dana Spicer engineer’s specifically designed the Ultimate Dana 44 to address the week axle tubes, brackets and axle shafts among other things on the JK for off-road use with 37” tires. I will tell you we did in fact strengthen the end forgings as well. Above 37” tires I would go with the Dana 60 or the like.”
So, guys and gals….. Whether or not you believe what this engineer told me, I am just passing the information on.
I myself, will not weld onto the end forgings and I PROBABLY will be buying the Ultimate Dana 44 with 4.88’s because I will not be running anything bigger than 37” tires, nor will I drive my Jeep like a Rock Bouncer!
Earlier I got off the phone with a Dana Spicer engineer and this is what he said about the end forging/yolk/Inner-C and Ultimate Dana 44.
Me: “Just about everyone I talk to recommends welding on Inner-C gussets on Dana 44’s because they bend. And that the Ultimate Dana 44 looks to be the same”
Engineer: "Dana axle end forgings are not the parts that these guys are bending, it's the axle tube, specifically the long side. Anything short of a car wreck is not going to bend the end forgings. These Jeep forums and Internet blogs have been feed a lie from who knows where and are full of BS. Furthermore if you weld on the gussets they sell for the end forgings, your “Inner-C” you'll actually make it weaker because of the heat needed to weld them on changes the grain size, structure and flow imparted by the forging process, so don't do that!”
Me: “What about putting sleeves in mine?”
Engineer: “I’m not in sales and can’t tell you what to buy or do, if done properly installing sleeves will help but it’s a Band-Aid at best, a single thicker tube is far stronger. If you are going to run 35" or 37" tires and actually go off-roading with your JK I would recommend whether or not you buy the Ultimate Dana 44 from us you should upgrade your front axle. Myself and the other Dana Spicer engineer’s specifically designed the Ultimate Dana 44 to address the week axle tubes, brackets and axle shafts among other things on the JK for off-road use with 37” tires. I will tell you we did in fact strengthen the end forgings as well. Above 37” tires I would go with the Dana 60 or the like.”
So, guys and gals….. Whether or not you believe what this engineer told me, I am just passing the information on.
I myself, will not weld onto the end forgings and I PROBABLY will be buying the Ultimate Dana 44 with 4.88’s because I will not be running anything bigger than 37” tires, nor will I drive my Jeep like a Rock Bouncer!
If you want a look at what we engineered into our ProRock 44 axle, check out this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_pjVPUnRfMg The Dynatrac ProRock 44 has the most ground clearance of any 44-based axle, thanks to its patented ProRock design. Dynatrac was founded building performance axles for the off-road market – we engineer solutions for the way that people use their Jeeps off-road and the types of stress and pressure that axles see in these types of environments with larger tires, lift kits and lockers.
12-30-2016, 04:23 PM
#36
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I completely agree that your ProRock 44 is probably hands down the best D44 redux on earth. If I can manage it I might buy your PR44, but all things considered I am still digging and researching.
But... I am a bit suprised about your "There’s a reason that companies sell reinforcement for the factory Dana 44 C forgings." statement. When someone can show me actual proof that a 37" tire clad JK that bent the C forging under normal offroading/rock crawling - not in a KOH or rock bouncer race I will believe the nessesity for goliath Dynatrac/Currie/Teraflex/G2 C forgings. Seriously, there must be a reason stoked by actual and real failures, not by rumors and marketing hype.
Now concerning the tubes and housing as well as the marrage of them both the Dana engineer spoke to and real life photograped failures from actual end user experiences is evident. So Dynatrac, will trussing the stock Dana 44 be more than just a "Band aid" for tube and tube to housing failure?
So far I have only seen one or two center housing bridged trusses fior the front D44. Your thoughts?
Respectfully Marc, AKA: Sirjeepalot.
But... I am a bit suprised about your "There’s a reason that companies sell reinforcement for the factory Dana 44 C forgings." statement. When someone can show me actual proof that a 37" tire clad JK that bent the C forging under normal offroading/rock crawling - not in a KOH or rock bouncer race I will believe the nessesity for goliath Dynatrac/Currie/Teraflex/G2 C forgings. Seriously, there must be a reason stoked by actual and real failures, not by rumors and marketing hype.
Now concerning the tubes and housing as well as the marrage of them both the Dana engineer spoke to and real life photograped failures from actual end user experiences is evident. So Dynatrac, will trussing the stock Dana 44 be more than just a "Band aid" for tube and tube to housing failure?
So far I have only seen one or two center housing bridged trusses fior the front D44. Your thoughts?
Respectfully Marc, AKA: Sirjeepalot.
12-30-2016, 04:50 PM
#37
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DYNATRAC...
I also agree that your Dynatrac Ultimate PR44 has no match both in tube, C, and brackets, and If I were not on a budget and/or was an extreme wheeler I would certainly have your axles combined with bigger brakes and J8 bearings.. Or a D60 set up...
For me it is building a diff for job required ... As beautiful as the PR44 is it is way overkill for me..
I also agree that your Dynatrac Ultimate PR44 has no match both in tube, C, and brackets, and If I were not on a budget and/or was an extreme wheeler I would certainly have your axles combined with bigger brakes and J8 bearings.. Or a D60 set up...
For me it is building a diff for job required ... As beautiful as the PR44 is it is way overkill for me..
12-30-2016, 04:58 PM
#38
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DYNATRAC...
I also agree that your Dynatrac Ultimate PR44 has no match both in tube, C, and brackets, and If I were not on a budget and/or was an extreme wheeler I would certainly have your axles combined with bigger brakes and J8 bearings.. Or a D60 set up...
For me it is building a diff for job required ... As beautiful as the PR44 is it is way overkill for me..
I also agree that your Dynatrac Ultimate PR44 has no match both in tube, C, and brackets, and If I were not on a budget and/or was an extreme wheeler I would certainly have your axles combined with bigger brakes and J8 bearings.. Or a D60 set up...
For me it is building a diff for job required ... As beautiful as the PR44 is it is way overkill for me..
12-31-2016, 08:12 AM
#39
Sponsoring Manufacturer
I completely agree that your ProRock 44 is probably hands down the best D44 redux on earth. If I can manage it I might buy your PR44, but all things considered I am still digging and researching.
But... I am a bit suprised about your "There’s a reason that companies sell reinforcement for the factory Dana 44 C forgings." statement. When someone can show me actual proof that a 37" tire clad JK that bent the C forging under normal offroading/rock crawling - not in a KOH or rock bouncer race I will believe the nessesity for goliath Dynatrac/Currie/Teraflex/G2 C forgings. Seriously, there must be a reason stoked by actual and real failures, not by rumors and marketing hype.
Now concerning the tubes and housing as well as the marrage of them both the Dana engineer spoke to and real life photograped failures from actual end user experiences is evident. So Dynatrac, will trussing the stock Dana 44 be more than just a "Band aid" for tube and tube to housing failure?
So far I have only seen one or two center housing bridged trusses fior the front D44. Your thoughts?
Respectfully Marc, AKA: Sirjeepalot.
But... I am a bit suprised about your "There’s a reason that companies sell reinforcement for the factory Dana 44 C forgings." statement. When someone can show me actual proof that a 37" tire clad JK that bent the C forging under normal offroading/rock crawling - not in a KOH or rock bouncer race I will believe the nessesity for goliath Dynatrac/Currie/Teraflex/G2 C forgings. Seriously, there must be a reason stoked by actual and real failures, not by rumors and marketing hype.
Now concerning the tubes and housing as well as the marrage of them both the Dana engineer spoke to and real life photograped failures from actual end user experiences is evident. So Dynatrac, will trussing the stock Dana 44 be more than just a "Band aid" for tube and tube to housing failure?
So far I have only seen one or two center housing bridged trusses fior the front D44. Your thoughts?
Respectfully Marc, AKA: Sirjeepalot.
12-31-2016, 08:13 AM
#40
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[QUOTE=Canvas;4268681]I upgraded to the Ultimate 44 last spring and prior to installing it I had an Artec Truss kit installed. The reason I did this was for the added security. Sleeves work for some but depending on what sleeve you use you compromise the housing by drilling into it for the rosette welds. The Artec truss provides the added insurance agains breaking.
As for the upgraded drive shafts I would recommend the Adams 1310 simply because that is what I am running. Chromoly shafts with Spicer U
Hi Canvas,
Since you actually own a trussed Spicer Ultimate 44 with 5.13 gears.....
What are your thoughts on your 5.13 gearing choice running 35's? Or did you go to 37's?
What are your thoughts on the axle's performance thus far?
What kind of wheeling best describes you? (I am a 8 rated max rock crawl with a conservative skinny pedal)
What is your Ultimate 44 tube diameter? (My stock JKUR D44 is 2.5" Dia OD front & Rear D44 is 3.18" Dia OD)
Did you weld or have your Artec truss welded to the center housing? Elaborate if possible.
Lastly, what type of ball joints did it come with – Stock, or?
As for the upgraded drive shafts I would recommend the Adams 1310 simply because that is what I am running. Chromoly shafts with Spicer U
Hi Canvas,
Since you actually own a trussed Spicer Ultimate 44 with 5.13 gears.....
What are your thoughts on your 5.13 gearing choice running 35's? Or did you go to 37's?
What are your thoughts on the axle's performance thus far?
What kind of wheeling best describes you? (I am a 8 rated max rock crawl with a conservative skinny pedal)
What is your Ultimate 44 tube diameter? (My stock JKUR D44 is 2.5" Dia OD front & Rear D44 is 3.18" Dia OD)
Did you weld or have your Artec truss welded to the center housing? Elaborate if possible.
Lastly, what type of ball joints did it come with – Stock, or?