Amsoil hype? Lets find out!
12-12-2015, 12:47 PM
#121
JK Newbie
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Nashville
Posts: 52
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
re:Amsoil hype? Let's find out
Well, that is 30min of time spent (for virtually no gain whatsoever )that I will never get back !
I read all of this & while I think it admirable the OP was 'trying to get to the bottom of this subject" for the masses, it seems he found out the same thing that BTOG & thousands of automotive racers & their mechanical staff have known for years; that the frequency of change to whatever oil /lubricant is the primary action of benefit and if the selected lubricant has polymers or additives that excell in areas where heat extremes exist & can lessen the impact of wear upon components , well that is the gravy.
I will offer my current usage/history( briefly) / vehicles for any other folks that get dug into reading this before being disappointed at having done so .
I have ( currently) three Jeeps . I have owned four in my 45 years and also many, many other combustion engined autos/motorcycles /lawnmowers/tractors, etc.
They are as follow:
1994 Jeep Wrangler Sahara (YJ)with the HO 4.0L inline 6 . It has 110,000 on odometer of which 84,000 were towed behind a mobile home so the engine is basically just getting started. Purchased used from a little old couple that towed it behind their vacation RV for a decade then it sat stored properly for 5 years.
1995 Jeep Cherokee Country 'upcountry' package -4.0l HO inline6 with no motor modifications except a new radiator ,a Northstar battery , and some higher quality ignition items like a rotor and cap for dist. original purchaser and currently has 388,400miles on the odometer all placed there by my wife and myself after buying it new in Nov. 1995. It is my wifes primary lover ( jk) and a family member. A DD that sees nominal trails but mostly crawls malls and school parking lots these days as a family shuttle.
a 2011 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited (a Sahara initially but ordered with 4.10 gearing and an LSD in rear 44 for towing - never picked up by orderer so I got it new in Feb 2012 with 300 miles on it ) . It used to be my commuter DD & while still a DD, it is 85-90% rock/trail usage as I work from home and no longer drive 40 mile round trip per day. It has 88,000 on odometer for the 3.8l V-6 and has no upgrades to engine ( unlike everything else) aside from a drop in Afe DryS filter and sparkplug boots.
the YJ is reserved for forest trails and travel around Blue Ridge , Ga . Garaged it sees about 1000-200 miles per year. It runs 10w-40 Shell Rotella with WIX filters since acquired. no compression loss or leaks and averages about 16-20mpg but alot of those are off road and infrequent it is an anomoly but will continue to recieve OIL /OIL FILTER CHANGES AT 3000 miles exactly with 1 part of five being Prolong HD Oil Stabilzer when changed.
the XJ is the one that will speak the most. It i sdriven th emost , has a hard life still and has highest mileage. As it nears 400,000 original miles it still pulls like new. Compression is fine and it gets about 14-18mpg around town. It needs a new front Oilpan gasket main seal as there is a small leak but not enough to drip . I always ran 10w40 Shell Rotella in her but at 300,000 I began to think about how high that amount of miles is and wanted insurance. I talked to some truckers and some mechanics that work on big tractor trailer trucks. They reminded me that the CHANGE INTERVAL is so much more critial than what you change to. That being said they admited that the majority of additives just replenish stuff such as Zinc and copper to re-enforce what many oils lose when broken down by heat over long usage periods . They aknowledged how similar the 4.0 liter inline6 HO motors in the 90s/2000s era Jeeps are not at all unline big diesel engines and that is why they run so long. This Jeep was switched over to T6 Shell Rotella 15w-40 dino oil with 1:5 ratio of PROLONG HD OIL STABILIZER ( I am not affilaited with them) added at every change at 3000miles. Recently, change to new valve cover gasket revealed what looked like a new engine under the cover. It is drained and no metal shavings affixed to magnet appear nor dry starts ever happen ( I allow all three Jeeps to run in Nuetral for 30-60sec after starting and before moving their auto tranny into gear) . It continues to happily drive along and I see no reason it should not reach 500k miles.
The 3.8 liter had it's breakin period of 600miles and that checkup was the only service center visit ever made. I began running Amsoil 5w-30 Signature Series oil with the Ea filter at 601 miles and have never lost oil thru 'burning' , had to add oil to it between changes nor heard any ticking or had any issues . This four door JK gets driven VERY hard. It is not uncommon for me to drive 150 miles, wheel very difficult trails where it idles and gets very hot ( I have hood louvers and spal fans in strategic places as well as aux coolers for oil and tranny ) then turn around and drive home 150 miles. I run only Amsoil ATF in the transfer case and their Severe Gear 75w-90 in front diff and 75-140 in rear diff. Never have metal shavings when I change the diff fluid twice per year. I drain the xfer case and refill once per year. It shifts into all 4L/4H and back with no noise. It is always new looking when drained. I change the oil like a clock bell on this Jeep at precisely 3000 miles even running the costly Amsoil. I do not care about annual averages of money saved , I plan on having this jeep as my last vehicle for life and eventually will replace the engine, I am sure. But I have reached 88k with seemingly no internal engine wear and it purrs like a kitten. No spun bearings and I attribute this more to the frequent changes than th eoil BUT.... Amsoil has better high heat breakdown temps and really makes the motor perform smoothly considering the high tolerances of the passes within it and how sensitive to heat these 3.8s are. I feel it is overkill but I do not care. I drive it hard so treat it to expensive , high heat resistant racing oil because I want to. I will say I do not use Amsoil in the automatic transmission ( changed it once at 50k with Mopar ATF so I was playing by the book) but I may at next fileter and tranny fluid service ( 120,000? I have to look )
I have a pretty good track record with my jeeps so thought I would offer my take for anyone that gives a f*ck.
I do not advise or say ANYONE has to follow my lead but the XJ is gonna reach 400,000 using Shell Rotella 15w-40 and Prolong + WIX filters and the JK will reach ( I hope ) 100,000+ miles before I have to replace the engine with a HEMI or an LS , but until then it will keep getting changed every 3k miles with 5w-30 Amsoil and their Ea filter. The YJ will continue to get it's Rotella and Prolong as well but she sits about 8month per year so I don't worry about her as much as these other two here in Nashville with us.
Hope that helps. I do not think you need to waste $ like me by using Amsoil unless you want to ; I do suggest you change your oil regardless of what anyone or anywhre tells yo uat a 3000mile interval and you will probably have that car or truck for a good many miles.
OP; I know you had a turn around and it was a little interesting but you should go back and edit the first post to let folks know that you had grand intentions at the onset but that they may want to read to the final page so they can understand that it is a waste to read the middle pages as your goal changed. Just a thought.
I read all of this & while I think it admirable the OP was 'trying to get to the bottom of this subject" for the masses, it seems he found out the same thing that BTOG & thousands of automotive racers & their mechanical staff have known for years; that the frequency of change to whatever oil /lubricant is the primary action of benefit and if the selected lubricant has polymers or additives that excell in areas where heat extremes exist & can lessen the impact of wear upon components , well that is the gravy.
I will offer my current usage/history( briefly) / vehicles for any other folks that get dug into reading this before being disappointed at having done so .
I have ( currently) three Jeeps . I have owned four in my 45 years and also many, many other combustion engined autos/motorcycles /lawnmowers/tractors, etc.
They are as follow:
1994 Jeep Wrangler Sahara (YJ)with the HO 4.0L inline 6 . It has 110,000 on odometer of which 84,000 were towed behind a mobile home so the engine is basically just getting started. Purchased used from a little old couple that towed it behind their vacation RV for a decade then it sat stored properly for 5 years.
1995 Jeep Cherokee Country 'upcountry' package -4.0l HO inline6 with no motor modifications except a new radiator ,a Northstar battery , and some higher quality ignition items like a rotor and cap for dist. original purchaser and currently has 388,400miles on the odometer all placed there by my wife and myself after buying it new in Nov. 1995. It is my wifes primary lover ( jk) and a family member. A DD that sees nominal trails but mostly crawls malls and school parking lots these days as a family shuttle.
a 2011 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited (a Sahara initially but ordered with 4.10 gearing and an LSD in rear 44 for towing - never picked up by orderer so I got it new in Feb 2012 with 300 miles on it ) . It used to be my commuter DD & while still a DD, it is 85-90% rock/trail usage as I work from home and no longer drive 40 mile round trip per day. It has 88,000 on odometer for the 3.8l V-6 and has no upgrades to engine ( unlike everything else) aside from a drop in Afe DryS filter and sparkplug boots.
the YJ is reserved for forest trails and travel around Blue Ridge , Ga . Garaged it sees about 1000-200 miles per year. It runs 10w-40 Shell Rotella with WIX filters since acquired. no compression loss or leaks and averages about 16-20mpg but alot of those are off road and infrequent it is an anomoly but will continue to recieve OIL /OIL FILTER CHANGES AT 3000 miles exactly with 1 part of five being Prolong HD Oil Stabilzer when changed.
the XJ is the one that will speak the most. It i sdriven th emost , has a hard life still and has highest mileage. As it nears 400,000 original miles it still pulls like new. Compression is fine and it gets about 14-18mpg around town. It needs a new front Oilpan gasket main seal as there is a small leak but not enough to drip . I always ran 10w40 Shell Rotella in her but at 300,000 I began to think about how high that amount of miles is and wanted insurance. I talked to some truckers and some mechanics that work on big tractor trailer trucks. They reminded me that the CHANGE INTERVAL is so much more critial than what you change to. That being said they admited that the majority of additives just replenish stuff such as Zinc and copper to re-enforce what many oils lose when broken down by heat over long usage periods . They aknowledged how similar the 4.0 liter inline6 HO motors in the 90s/2000s era Jeeps are not at all unline big diesel engines and that is why they run so long. This Jeep was switched over to T6 Shell Rotella 15w-40 dino oil with 1:5 ratio of PROLONG HD OIL STABILIZER ( I am not affilaited with them) added at every change at 3000miles. Recently, change to new valve cover gasket revealed what looked like a new engine under the cover. It is drained and no metal shavings affixed to magnet appear nor dry starts ever happen ( I allow all three Jeeps to run in Nuetral for 30-60sec after starting and before moving their auto tranny into gear) . It continues to happily drive along and I see no reason it should not reach 500k miles.
The 3.8 liter had it's breakin period of 600miles and that checkup was the only service center visit ever made. I began running Amsoil 5w-30 Signature Series oil with the Ea filter at 601 miles and have never lost oil thru 'burning' , had to add oil to it between changes nor heard any ticking or had any issues . This four door JK gets driven VERY hard. It is not uncommon for me to drive 150 miles, wheel very difficult trails where it idles and gets very hot ( I have hood louvers and spal fans in strategic places as well as aux coolers for oil and tranny ) then turn around and drive home 150 miles. I run only Amsoil ATF in the transfer case and their Severe Gear 75w-90 in front diff and 75-140 in rear diff. Never have metal shavings when I change the diff fluid twice per year. I drain the xfer case and refill once per year. It shifts into all 4L/4H and back with no noise. It is always new looking when drained. I change the oil like a clock bell on this Jeep at precisely 3000 miles even running the costly Amsoil. I do not care about annual averages of money saved , I plan on having this jeep as my last vehicle for life and eventually will replace the engine, I am sure. But I have reached 88k with seemingly no internal engine wear and it purrs like a kitten. No spun bearings and I attribute this more to the frequent changes than th eoil BUT.... Amsoil has better high heat breakdown temps and really makes the motor perform smoothly considering the high tolerances of the passes within it and how sensitive to heat these 3.8s are. I feel it is overkill but I do not care. I drive it hard so treat it to expensive , high heat resistant racing oil because I want to. I will say I do not use Amsoil in the automatic transmission ( changed it once at 50k with Mopar ATF so I was playing by the book) but I may at next fileter and tranny fluid service ( 120,000? I have to look )
I have a pretty good track record with my jeeps so thought I would offer my take for anyone that gives a f*ck.
I do not advise or say ANYONE has to follow my lead but the XJ is gonna reach 400,000 using Shell Rotella 15w-40 and Prolong + WIX filters and the JK will reach ( I hope ) 100,000+ miles before I have to replace the engine with a HEMI or an LS , but until then it will keep getting changed every 3k miles with 5w-30 Amsoil and their Ea filter. The YJ will continue to get it's Rotella and Prolong as well but she sits about 8month per year so I don't worry about her as much as these other two here in Nashville with us.
Hope that helps. I do not think you need to waste $ like me by using Amsoil unless you want to ; I do suggest you change your oil regardless of what anyone or anywhre tells yo uat a 3000mile interval and you will probably have that car or truck for a good many miles.
OP; I know you had a turn around and it was a little interesting but you should go back and edit the first post to let folks know that you had grand intentions at the onset but that they may want to read to the final page so they can understand that it is a waste to read the middle pages as your goal changed. Just a thought.
01-28-2021, 06:12 AM
#123
JK Newbie
Join Date: Jan 2021
Location: Quebec, Canada
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Really? A few hundred miles? What is it that you think the motor oil additives do exactly? There are surely some detergents and neutralizers in there, but the big issue would be the polymers that allow the weight of the oil to change when heated, and those are going to wear out. Probably before 25k miles. The "used oil analysis" - what does that include? Viscosity checks at various temperatures to ensure that the viscosity changing polymers are intact? A full analysis down to the molecular structure of the oil? I don't think so. I may be wrong, but those tests would cost much more than simply replacing the oil, and lose the cost benefit that they supposedly provide. What they do measure, is particulate and contaminant in the oil. I don't know for sure, but I think that the additives that allow a multiple weight oil (5w-20, etc) break down after 6k miles or less, and that is a big reason why the oil needs to be changed. Also to remove chemical contaminants. After those break down you will be running straight 20.
Got to give you props for doing the experiment on a brand new engine.
Why is it such an advantage to change your oil every 25k miles? I don't get it. And "very different qualities and behaviors?" Come on. Amsoil is a better oil, but very different is a stretch and a half. You aren't talking about the difference between canola oil and Amsoil. They are both high quality synthetic lubricants that MUST meet certain standards, and the standards are not just arbitrary.
Also, it will void your warranty. Chrysler can not void a warranty by your use of synthetic - but changing the oil on a schedule more than 6k miles is expressly prohibited and clearly not allowed. 25k is very, very far from 6k. I don't imagine a warranty being denied because you changed the oil at 6,400, but 25,000 - well yeah, and justifiably so. If it fails you are going to be on the hook - EVEN if it was a BAD ENGINE and TOTALLY their fault!!! They can not prove that the oil caused the engine to fail, but they can demonstrate blatant disregard for what they said was needed to maintain the warranty - that is all they need. And unless Amsoil is going to step in and foot the bill for the engine (not likely), you are going to be out a whole lot more money than you would just changing it on schedule.
Good luck, and I mean it. What I am more interested in is the mpg improvement. I noticed a definite and immediate increase (2mpg or so) when I switched everything to Mobil-1. If Amsoil gives 2mpg more, then it will pay for itself in short order.
Got to give you props for doing the experiment on a brand new engine.
Why is it such an advantage to change your oil every 25k miles? I don't get it. And "very different qualities and behaviors?" Come on. Amsoil is a better oil, but very different is a stretch and a half. You aren't talking about the difference between canola oil and Amsoil. They are both high quality synthetic lubricants that MUST meet certain standards, and the standards are not just arbitrary.
Also, it will void your warranty. Chrysler can not void a warranty by your use of synthetic - but changing the oil on a schedule more than 6k miles is expressly prohibited and clearly not allowed. 25k is very, very far from 6k. I don't imagine a warranty being denied because you changed the oil at 6,400, but 25,000 - well yeah, and justifiably so. If it fails you are going to be on the hook - EVEN if it was a BAD ENGINE and TOTALLY their fault!!! They can not prove that the oil caused the engine to fail, but they can demonstrate blatant disregard for what they said was needed to maintain the warranty - that is all they need. And unless Amsoil is going to step in and foot the bill for the engine (not likely), you are going to be out a whole lot more money than you would just changing it on schedule.
Good luck, and I mean it. What I am more interested in is the mpg improvement. I noticed a definite and immediate increase (2mpg or so) when I switched everything to Mobil-1. If Amsoil gives 2mpg more, then it will pay for itself in short order.
01-29-2021, 07:19 AM
#124
JK Enthusiast
yes I realize an old thread, but there's nothing that has convinced me to go with anything amsoil.. even after an amsoil spokesperson attempted to send me a case of their product. I decline their offer.