Yeah, that was interesting... Couple things I learned, or already knew but got reinforced:

1) Next time... the trail leaders should not allow somebody to attempt something that is clearly futile. If I go out there again, and somebody wants to try something like that, I'll tell them "No!" or "Ok, but if you don't make it, we're taking YOU out, but you have to figure out how to get your truck out by yourself". It would have been one thing if he wanted to attempt that and he was within 80 feet of the shore. Then we could just do one winch pull, and it's all good. But that little stunt risked everybody else's truck, and it was completely unnecessary.

I'm sorry I couldn't have helped more, I was next in line after Dave, but just as I was about to go in I had a potty emergency with my son. I also didn't want to go in past my floorboards. Crossing water is one thing, but sitting in it is different.

2) I mentioned to Dave that he shouldn't pull hard in reverse, and he did. You really have to watch that, because the ring and pinion are much weaker in reverse.

3) I saw it a number of times, but NEVER pull on the wingh cable by driving backwards. You winch with a winch. Driving backwards can shock load the cable. We saw that when the cable snapped. We're all lucky that the water damped the cable so it didn't result in somebody have a REALLY bad day. Also, pulling on the winch cable is really hard on your winch too. The winch is designed to stall when it's overloaded. Driving backwards you can overload the whole system.

4) Group members going not only out of visible range, but radio range... really bad. Especially when you take a wrong turn. Woulda been a long night if everybody else had gone out the right way, and you'd gotten yourself stuck.

5) Yes, everybody should have straps connected before attempting any mud or water obstacles. Even if it's just a tree saver strap... give us *something* we can reach.

Regardless of all that, I had a great time. That's a really nice entry level trail (minus the one water crossing). Having the snorkel and my diff guards really made the day more fun because I could drive with confidence compared to last year. Next up is a "Sumo" trackbar cause mine has had it. My son enjoyed it too, just got a little tired because he didn't have a proper nap.

Oh, and Dave, best way to clean out your Jeep: I used to be a detailer at a dealership. We'd litterally pour a bit of soapy water in the footwell, scrub it with an old fashioned floor scrub brush, then wet/dry vac it. Should come out good as new. I do this with all my cars every spring. It's better than any spot treatments or simple vacumming. Everything got soaked already, a little clean soapy water won't hurt anything at this point. Same deal with your seats. Liberal amounts of soapy water, then suck 'em dry. There shouldn't be anything in there that's not waterproof. The hardest part is drying everything out. Best to do it on a warm sunny day.

 

Short clip of one of the water crossings. I'll try to put one together for the TJ fiasco.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdRuYkM3zyI

 

Got to todds this afternoon and stripped the jeep, got a lot of the junk out, hosed it, and shop vaced it dry. Steam cleaned the seats which helped a lot. Left my back seats and a bunch of stuff at his place to dry. and hes going to take my soaked CB to work to try and fix up. thanks again todd

Other issues, passenger airbag light on, definitely have some water or something in my diffs (could be my clutch as well), i will switch them out tomorrow for my new solid ones. and the fan is still not working so i'll have to get that figured out as well.

 

I think that lesson is one of the biggest; those who knew the extent of the water crossing (been t here before) really should have laid it down and prevented someone from doing something that endangers everyone else.

Agreed about the trail leaders on both accounts of taking off an leaving everyone behind (though at the end I was trying to get going fast as i could to keep the engine cool) and allowing mike to get into that situation in the first place. Neither of those things should have happened.

I had originally wanted to winch from closer to shore (which I should have done) but was told that I should drive up to him and yank with my winch (both things that were totally wrong to do) Lesson: don't necessarily listen to those "more experienced"

 

I definitely said to him
you will not make it to the other side.

dion was a little more wishy washy with his response

we leaders took off to get moving and get off the trail it was nearly six and many people had to get going

it is a one way single track trail and the trail lead vehicle new that the JKs behind had GPS on
dion also went and scouted ahead a what is marked as a dead end at my request.

also by jumping ahead we got good pictures

pace is set by trail leader based on equipment in the pack and there was no reason for him to end up that far ahead. also we were told by tunes to scout out where the trail was.

the reason for the winch pull as there was no shock load as it was not a yank. and it was to keep a short tether to make it easier to control the vehicles. but short tether got lost in translation when the truth of water kicked in, i guess.

a recovery strap would have been to long and the tj would never have made it around the dog leg.

the discovery would have made it in 10 feet and it would have water coming in past the door seals the dions JK made it in 15ft and had water going in

the dog leg was an intricate part as to how this recovery went if it was a straight line pull a bunch of recovery straps linked together and a pull up the hill it would have been all said and done easily

but this wasn't a normal recovery.

the biggest part was to get the tj into a straight line pull off the dog leg apex.

that being said sitting from the comfort of my computer chair,

things that went right are:
the engines died on their own
the tj got pulled and winched back to the apex of the dog leg
the JK didn't flip into the march
the JK did successfully get winched and turned from east to west and onto the underwater rd.
the jeeps did start and drive out
the owners did make it home
the cable didn't snap it un-spooled from the winch and ripped the anchor lead from the spool, that is what happens when you don't leave the red on the spool.

lesson's learned
have strap ready before entering challenge
if your the new guy who owns the cheapest vehicle don't say. i want to put a 350 in it anyways. and expect people to get wet for you
if one person says. "you will not make it" don't listen to anyone that says anything else
why was rob driving around with waders anyhow?
keep red on the spool
discern which advice to listen to.
think things through prior to acting.
mount cb high cause if you flood then you have no coms
the module under the passenger seat for the airbag is likely not water proof.
panicking while pulling is not good
care and control must be a discipline while recovering
going in to recover? do you qualify based on experience or based on how your vehicle is equipped
if your vehicle stalls out in water you are ok just don't throttle or restart.
if you jeep dies and you get pulled to higher ground in the water check your air box and inlet tube to ensure dryness and restart if it is and drive out under own power (tj)

 

Wow..... I think I am going to just steer clear of water crossings!

Glad to hear that all's well that ends well!

 

unspooling your winch under water for rob to hook on to the tj was wrong.

how were you going to get him around the dog leg
though it ....that won't work

all would have went well if you kept a short tether on the winch and controlled your fear about the water coming in and didn't start the pull with balls to the wall.

the short non stretch tether would have allowed for a smooth pull as he was not stuck on anything he was on a road (underwater rd but still a road) you just had to pull up hook him and drive out in reverse the short tether would have allowed for easy control around the dog leg. as no one would have to swing wide to allow a vehicle to not cut the inside of the apex. it would have simply stayed on course smooth and steady and turn the corner no one would have cut wide or cut the apex.

mike was told by me not to do it as he will not make the other side.

I'm not the trail police
I offered my advice and no one choose to follow my instructions
one tj sunk, one JK off the road into the march nearly flipping over.

It was my idea to turn you from heading east to head west bringing you back on to the road, it was you who neglected to turn your wheels in the direction of being recovered which lead to you almost being winched over.

I'm the one who confirmed your JK was start-able and started it and got it running with help while you were getting warm.

Dave you lay blame but you may be tunnel visioned post traumatic syndrome, but we all had your best interests in mind to get you out and then the tj out.

you can rant about my experience all you want but i was on shore working out on how to get you out the others had the equipment and physical ability, I had my experience from very similar situations to get your rig out and out of the way to get the tj out. other methods to get you out would have involved submerging ur JK or abandon cause that was mentioned on shore and by you.

in the end the only real words from you should be "that sucked" and "thank you"

from the tj guy he should be saying "sorry and thank you to everyone."

i'm done about this, you are on shore you are now warm and dry you have all your limbs and you still drove home. you are welcome dave!

peace out

 

Wow..those are some good pictures...glad you guys made it out ok and after reading all the posts, seems like you're all relatively up and running again! That is why water scares me!

 

Scott, that was not meant as an attack on you. I said I appreciate everyones help, and I thanked everyone as I left the gas station as well. I do appreciate everyone working to get me out. My comments were meant to be general, and I'm certainly not placing the blame on you, what happened happened and we all learned from it. But after what I went through trying to help a fellow jeeper if would be nice if you weren't critiquing and criticizing me for what happened or telling me "what you would have done" maybe it might have helped if you told me all that before I entered the water.I did what you told me,and took your advice which got me into the potentially hazardous situation in the first place. As I started backing up, the winch was set to unspool, not my fault as I didn't know this.

All I'm trying to say is that things could have been done a lot differently and saved a lot of grief. But hindsight is 20/20.I'm not blaming anyone specifically. Like I said I learned a lot and most of that is be more confident in myself and my decisions and not allow others to make them for me.either way what's done is done, I made it out and hopefully my jeep is going to be alright, but don't go taking all that credit for it scott, I didn't see you getting in the water, (but instead telling me to jump in to do it myself) or doing much else without your rig there. I know everyone played some part in getting me out which is why I said thank you in the first place.

Enough ranting its all done and over now.

Btw its marSh not march.

 

Wow looks like you guys had an interesting day to say the least. I was gonna come out and go with you guys but had to work that day. Glad to see everyone made it out. Seeing that scares the crap out of me.