That's a whole different animal......

Like I said before, I wasn't trying to offend the JK Unlimited owners, but I know first hand the disavantages of the longer wheel base..........

I think the 103" wheelbase of my 05' Unlimited is pushing it.......A 2-Door with a 100" wheelbase would be perfect.

"Modified JK Tech (10 Viewing)
Tech related bulletin board forum regarding subjects such as suspension, tires & wheels, steering, bumpers, skid plates, drive train, cages, lighting, on-board air and other useful modifications that will help improve the performance and protection of your Jeep JK Wrangler (Rubicon, Sahara, Unlimited and X) on the trail."

This is where this thread is supposed to be..............Which was where it was originally posted..........

I don't want to hijack the thread but, If you are going to make broad generalizations such as the one you just made, I expect a good justification and defense stating the reasons why. It's not at all obvious or clear to me why a longer wheel base doesn't also have various benefits that could outweigh detriments...I've read various Jim Allen books, a serious off-roader, who would have to disagree with you on the swb vehicle as being far superior to a longer.

Breakover angle.........

I never said "Far Superior".........There some advantages to a longer wheelbase.....I would not get rid of my 05' Unlimited for a standard TJ under any circumstances...........Unless it was stretched......!!!!!

Here's mine minus a few recent mods...
[IMG]http://my.project-jk.com/data/500/me..._Install27.jpg[/IMG]

Fabricating those rear doors was a real pain!:rotflmao1:

"In my opinion the wheelbase of the JK unlimited is to long to be a serious offroader.........The idea of a JK 2-Door with an extra four or five inches of wheelbase is more of what I'm thinking......."
Don't follow me, you won't make it.:yup:

Whoa. I don't think the poster was saying that the Unlimiteds have no advantages, because they do. However, the shorter wheelbase undeniably has advantages over the Unlimited in certain areas (e.g. breakover angle). These reasons are well known generally, so there's no expectation that the poster would delineate them. However, it's okay if you don't know what those reasons are. And if that is the case I'd recommend that you make a post with your questions.

I assume your joking.......

I merely wanted to show that broad generalizations such as if your vehicle is for serious off-roading that it need be a SWB vehicle (under 100) are unfounded. My biggest pet peeve is lack of justification and argumentation and I will call people out on that. Breakover angles are merely one aspect of off-roading and just because one vehicle has a superior ramp breakover angle (stock) does not draw the line between a serious off-roader. For example, people complained about the new 2dr jk being larger than the TJ by 2 inches (wheelbase) and the breakover angles being different, until you put a optional 32 tire on and the break over angle remains unchanged(which the JK can fit without any lift, unlike the TJ which to my knowledge, stock, can only fit 31). Breakover angle can be mitigated with larger tires and life kits. I merely wanted to point out that breakover angle is one factor. For example, if the ORV has a large breakover angle, but sacrifices a higher center of gravity because of it, there is a balancing test involved in determining the appropriate decision between the two. That is a weakness of SWB, a higher center of gravity. All i expect, is justification, and that is what I meant by my post.

And I do think it is appropriate for a poster to "delineate" the reasons if he/she is making a claim such as that, or else they are begging the question. I realize that breakover angle is superior for the SWB vehicles, but that reason alone does not mean that the vehicle is automatically a serious off-roader. Just because something has advantages in certain aspects does not make it superior or "Serious" than another. Thats a "serious" fallacy.

WOW, ok.... just so you know the break over angle is a big benefit of having a shorter wheel base.

an unlimited and a two door for example... are going up a hill (they are both stock lets say) the unlimited bottoms out at the peak while the 2 door keeps on going.... sounds like an advantage to me?!:bleh:

When was the last time you saw two stock JK's offroad? More than once I have had to assist a 2 door over that crest. Length is one factor out of many. Don't forget driver skill level, skids, sliders, lift, tire size, lockers, weight distribution, etc.... Most of those compensators are much cheaper than elongating a 2 door. Wasn't the 2006 Unlimited a limited experiment into that line of thought?

Ohh and yes I was serious about not following me. Come on out and drive the mountains... You have been challenged. Winner gets to have a blast...so does everyone else. Hmm I think I've come up with a true win-win situation here.:yup:
If you've never ridden the Rockies, you owe it to yourself.