Hey guys,

Looking for opinions - I'm really starting to dig the Jeep buildout, and although I'm not ready to pull that card out yet (waiting for a Canadian store that might be coming soon ), I'd like to start planning what to do in the next few months.

Here's what I have:

OME lift - HD on both front and back - highly recommended

Mickey Thompson 33" Baja ATZ - highly recommended

Bestop flexatrunk - awesome, highly recommended - my first Jeep mod

Bestop JK softdoors - the verdict is still out on these... they look sweet, but they don't fit quite right, and adjusting them is a pain in the ass, and it seems like I have to do so every time I take them on and off. To make matters worse, I saw a JK yesterday with the element doors and it looked really, really good. On the other hand, the flexibility with the soft windows is nice - they're in the trunk if it rains. But they're LOUD on the highway, and they leak quite nicely. It's possible that I don't have them installed correctly. This weekend I found myself putting the hard doors back on for a trip to Windsor, which isn't a good sign. If you're considering these, I would hold off until Bestop makes changes for their second run, which I heard they're going to be doing.

Cobra 75/Firestick - the standard JK installation that everyone here seems to do. I love it.

Mopar enhanced rock rails - believe it or not, I really liked the steps that the sahara came with. But after the rock rails were installed, the jeep looked completely different in a very good way. Highly recommended.

AEM Bruce Force CAI - I love the way it sounds, BUT, I've scared myself silly reading hydrolocked threads here. The jeep *seems* to have better pickup, but I can't quantify that.

What I'm considering

LoD rear bumper (pics here - I really, really like the look of their rear bumper with the spare tire holder and jerry can holder. Questions:

- 1) Will that jerry can holder fit any size jerry can (are jerry can sizes standard)?

- 2) Expedition rack - yay or neigh? Two options exist. I can get that LoD one, or I can get a roof rack. Pics here of the LoD bumper with jerry can holder + wild boar roof rack (btw - that's a damned nice JK he's selling).

I need a front bumper of some sort. I'm fairly certain I want to have a winch, so I'm open to ideas. Any preferences on bumpers? Stubby or full size? This is the part where I could use some opinions.

For a winch - I'm considering the WARN with the air compressor. Other than cost, positives/negatives vs. any other particular style/type of winch?

Lockers - yay/nay? When do I actually need them? Did I make a mistake getting a Sahara and will now pay for it?

Skid plates - at what point do I go to something stronger?

CAI - On or off? Snorkel? Snorkels look rediculous in my opinion, and this is my daily driver. I think someone makes one that comes on and off... AEV maybe? I think theirs required replacing the hood too for no-drill.

Anything else I should consider?

My interest is expedition use a la the Overland guys (so Derek and Dion I'm interested in your opinion!), but this will remain my DD, so any practicality concerns would be helpful as well.

 

Well practicality / epxedition use is one in the same.

Basically you're building a vehicle that can accomodate both comfortable road conditions (long hauls on the highways) AND can accomodate an offroad tact in a manner that puts most other 4x4's on the Grocery detail.

The biggest thing that we follow is "Function OVER Form".....meaning we go for what works, not nessecarily what it looks like. Image is omportant, however if one product functions better than a prettier one.....well, the working one wins, the pretty one gets tossed.

The only snorkel that is available on the market right now is AEV. I do not like the look of it at all with the salad shooter looking thing on the top, BUT, it apparently works extremely well at filtering the air, that being said, I am concerned with roof rack fitment with that salad shooter on there.

A rack is absolutely essential for expeditions. I would favor a high end roof rack over a back rack.

Two gerry cans on the back of a back rack is just not enough especially when you're in the middle of nowhere. You need a minimum of 4 for these Jeeps....PLUS 4 water cans to....gas is the Jeeps life blood, water is ours.

A full length full weight quality roof rack is essential for a variety of reasons, carry external tools and equipment such as hi-lift, shovel, axe....all of your gerry cans, roof top tent, and your spare tire.

Yep, your spare tire. It is suggested and proven that carrying the spare wheel on the roof rack reduces the amount of stress the tire carrier receives. Over long periods, the spare carrier will vibrate alot....eventually leading to the bolts sheering and falling off. There is a compnay that makes gate re-enforcement brackets to help strengthen that issue, but best and cheapest fix is to the roof rack.

Gerry cans are suggested in "military format" from Scepter in Scarborough. Fuel cans in RED metal.....and water cans in blue, black, or green plastic.....most gerry cans are 20L ( Scepters Military line are all 20L)....so hence forth, 4 X 20L = 80L.......in other words virtually a full tank of gas for the JK....hence the reason for 4 cans required.

Winches.....any Warn winch will do you proud....the new Powerplant ones are quite nice.....just ensure that the MINIMUM poundage is 9500. The 9.5 Ti is nice to.

Stubby bumpers with winch carrying capacity is best....here in lies the FUNCTION OVER FORM argument. A stubby bumper is FUNCTIONAL in a number of ways.....less weight, open front wheels, and centers out the air bag impact points so you're not accidentally blowing your bag with a push on a far corner of a full length bumper....

Most stubbies are totally functional tools more than anything else.

As far as CAI is concerned, I hate to say it but I would trash that. It leaves the air intake totally exposed and open to pull in liquid. Those are more for rock crawlers and performance upgrades. The JKs have enough performance.....they're not race cars, they're not going to be fast.

Lockers.....yes. What else can I say. In severe terrain, even mildly rocky terrain, those lockers will be a life a saver not only to your tires but your axels health and transmission and differential gears.

Without them, you will get loads of tire spin and uneven where when trying to traverse rocky terrain, your diff, tranny and axels could suddenly lock out when a high speed spiining tire suddenly grabs and POW!!! something under that much sudden force will definitely break.

If you are considering expedition travel.....mild lift and MT tires are best, then start working on clearance, protection and storage.

The JK is utilitarian by nature, any kind of build for adventure will essentially make it MORE utilitarian in nature, and will certainly bring out its rugged good looks.

Being a daily driver, expedition preparation will make it a little "clunkier" in image and souond" but it will also maintain its useability for everyday life....when youor travelling for long periods you want a vehilces thats easy to drive and get in and out of......I couldnt imagine a long term trip in a vehicle with 40" tires and a 6" long arm lift....YIKES.

 

Looks like the bug has bitten....

 

Yup seems so....

 

I had some comments for you Jake, but it failed to send...twice...I'll try again later in the day.

Great ideas and products thou.

 

Hey Jake,

It sounds like you know exactly how far you want to take your Jeep and what you're going to use it for. That 's pretty much key here. It sounds like you want a DD that's expedition ready. Good choice.

For starters, lets begin with the choice of vehicule. You have a Sahara and are debating whether you should have gone with a Rubicon. If you had a choice, now, yes I would have gone with a Rubicon but lets deal with your current choice. There is absolutely nothing wrong with a Sahara. With a few careful, mods it will be the same or better than a Rubi.

You already know, that major difference is the Elockers as well as the Edisco. For the lockers, you could end up getting an Arb or if you want simplicity a Power trax (often refered to as a lunchbox locker but indestructible!). For sway disconnects, all you have to do is get manual disconnects; actually more reliable but take longer to take off. That's it.

Now for the internals. The engine is the same. The tranny is the same. The transfer case is little different. A Rubi has 4.1 where's yours has 2.73 to 1. As well, your gear are probably 3.73 (2008 tow package) vs. 4.10 on the Rubi. Ok, so what does this translate to. Basically, your RPM's will be lower on the trail, you will find it a little harder to crawl really slow. But, since your goal is an expedition vehicle, this should be just fine. On, the road, you will actually get better fuel economy. So, in the end in you case it might work out better.

As for the axles, yes, the Rubicon are stronger internally. Even the D44 which you might have in the rear is a little different inside, but not much. As for the front D35, unless you bash it, drive like an idiot on the trail, and put 37's, you'll be fine. The key here, is control and avoid excessive and abrupt wheel spin.

For suspension, I don't think we have to get into it, as you already have the ultimate setup for expedition use.

This leads us to tire choice and size. Since, it is your DD, but you still want a slightly bigger setup, the choice of tire is perfect for you. 33's will not be much bigger than stock, especially on the forces they will exhibit on the internals of the axles. Sure, 37's look cool but they are just to big. Not only, is there extra leverage outside of the design spec, but there is an increase in unsprung weight. A few individuals have even noticed that they are bending the C's on the axles, even on the so called bullet proof Dana 44's. Although, we tend to prefer MT's, the choice is ultimately yours. If you are happy with the tire, then that's what's most important. It's what you want out of it.

Front bumpers, go with something that's solid. Once again there are many manufactures out there that make great products, so in the end it will be what you like. The key thing I would look for is, whether your choice of winch will fit, whether you want to integrate the stock fog lites, and whether you want a full bumper or a stubby. A stubby does allow the tire to have more open area to go over obstacles but it allows provides less protection for the fenders. Most have recovery points, and most are heavy.

Back bumpers are a little different. Same thing, you're looking for protection and coverage, but also for whatever else you want to carry. The one you mention is a solid unit. Another one I would recommed is Expedition one (but it doesn't have the gas can carriers). The reason these are good, is they provide great protection, and are also heavy duty. What you want is a spindle that's at least 1.5 inches in diamter preferable with wheel bearings of some sorts. Think about it, a tire with rim (70 plus pounds), a cooler (50 plus pounds) , and 2 jerry cans (50 lbs each). That's a lot of weight. The last thing you want is all the weight to be moving around there because of poor design of spindle and latch setup.

Winches are phenomenal tools for the trail. They will allow you to extract yourself or a buddy from or over an obstacle. Any of the Warn winches are top notch products. The one you mention is with the compressor, so it will allow you to air up after the trail. Price is steep, but product is solid.

Racks, with racks you have to do a little research into what you will eventually have up there, and what the weight limits of each of the respective racks is. Racks like Garvin, and some other full roof rack look really good. They are probably rated for 300lbs at most. Now, that 300lbs, is for the road (dynamic) not the trail. Many will not tell you that. For the trail, I wouldn't take more than 40% of the recommened weight. The only one we have found that exceeds this is the Congo Rack. It's not the prettiest but their dynamic load limit is 500lbs, and it's static load is 1700lbs!!!! If any one finds a rack that can support more, please let us know. The rack is also modular in nature. You could add a roof top tent and a small basket for fuel and what not, and you would still be ok for the trail.

Jerr cans are a must for expedition use. They are a lot cheaper than adding long range tanks and can be taken off when not needed. The rear bumper you mention allows for standard fit jerry cans to be carried. They can be either plastic like Sceptor or metal like Wedco. Although, Sceptor is getting really popular, there is really not much difference between the two in terms of weight. I do find the metal ones slightly more resistant to continous abrasion as might happen on the road. But, then again they can also rust. So, here the choice is debatable.

As for CAI. For expedition use, they are not to good. Sure, they sound good and look even better, but water crossings are dangerous, and the amount of dust they will inhale will be much more than a standard setup. If you want a slight increase in power, then get a Hypertech module, and a insert panel filter. You'll get an increase of about 20 ft lbs or torque in as low as 1900 rpm. Which is what you want. And not horsepower at peak RPM. Torque is what moves weight. Another myth is that they call them CAI, but many do not do what they claim. If it's an open filter, it's actually drawing warm air from the engine compartment and not cold.

Sorry for rambling, but as you can see, we love talking equipment and shop. It sounds like you know exactly how for you want to take the Jeep, and you've done your homework as to what will fit for your use. The choice is ultimately yours. There is always a compromise, but so far you've made excellent choices if you want to build a daily driver that's expediton ready.

 

Wow. Can't ask for better responses than that. That's awesome.

 

Thanks guys! Off to digest...

 

basic rule of thumb
that is usually never followed
goes something like this
1 recovery - get yourself unstuck stock and later when lifted
2 lift /tires - stuff that allows u to get in deeper and less use of recovery
3 armour - bumpers rock rails under body armour
4 racks and mounts stop using up valuable space inside and move stoff to outside
5 looks
6 simplicity and usage

here is how i did it
1 front mopar bumper and a winch they go together
2 lift 3 in teraflex
3 added mopar rear bumper
4 added rack to mopar tire carrier
5 aev armour for the rear quarters and gas tank cover bug shield door edge guards
6 mounts for gps cell phone mp3 player

currently i'm back to armour and longevity and survivability


it also depends on budget and mechanical knowledge

enjoy
just emptying every pocket

 

I have had this happening a few time this week
i have learned to copy everything befor i hit submit