Which driveshaft
JK Jedi
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 4,798
Likes: 0
From: ....
Originally Posted by jeep2007
Really. I have a copy of the letter you were sent from Woods and it clearly outlines what companies make his joints including Spicer, Neapco and Rockford.
I also use products that I feel are the best I value, reliability and serve my needs. Not because Billy Bob says he does.
It's a fact if anyone on this forum uses or mentions any vendor other then a sponsor, its just not a good enough part. Even if your best sponsors sell that product.
Funny, you sent Woody an email on Feb 3, 2011 telling him " you make really good driveshafts and have good customer service and what you have can benefit our members". Only after he declined being a sponsor did you then blast his shafts. As you do with any non- sponsor.
I state the truth and this by no means takes away from Coast or JE Reel as they are excellent shafts too.Each Jeeper just has the right to be given the correct information.
I don't recall Eddie ever saying that there was a problem with Woods shafts. Eddie, as well as MANY people on this forum, in driveshaft shops across the country, and across the Internet, have stated that based on their real world experience they have seen numerous failures with Chinese joints. Are you actually saying all of these people are lying? Show me any actual comparison study of the various joints that proves these real world experiences wrong.
Your perception of what some BS letter repeating what it thinks Eddie may or may not have said in an email is, well, asinine and flat wrong. To be sure, Eddie rejected Woods request to be a sponsor, not the other way around. You want proof? I'm sure it's coming your way.
You can believe what you want...and you can stroke Woods' shaft in any way you see fit...just don't come on here spouting off your mouth about a bunch of crap you know absolutely nothing about.
"You state the truth"...give me a fucking break. You wouldn't know the truth if it beat you across the head.
JK Jedi
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 4,038
Likes: 1
From: NORTH JERSEY
Not that this thread needs more fuel, but I'm one of those ppl that has tw shafts and had issues. I've replaced all my ujoints with spicer ones. I rebalanced it because it was waaay off. The shop also repainted it for me and it's much better than original paint.
My friend has coasts and the overall quality is way better than mine.
If I knew now what I did back when I got my shafts I would not have gone with tw.
My friend has coasts and the overall quality is way better than mine.
If I knew now what I did back when I got my shafts I would not have gone with tw.
JK Jedi
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 5,022
Likes: 0
From: Copperopolis Ca
Originally Posted by Sharkey
You can believe what you want...and you can stroke Woods' shaft in any way you see fit...just don't come on here spouting off your mouth about a bunch of crap you know absolutely nothing about.
"You state the truth"...give me a fucking break. You wouldn't know the truth if it beat you across the head.
Ok I don't run woods or coast or any other big name shafts. I had a set custom made at a friend of mine driveshaft shop. He used quality u joints and after many years of hard abuse I have never had a issue. Regular maintance has proven that a quality u joint is what makes the driveshaft. Not the name.
That's my .002 cents. Take it or leave it.
Thread Starter
JK Freak
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 997
Likes: 2
From: Searcy, Arkansas
Wow I had no idea my question would strike up such a debate. All I am asking for is your experience with whatever shaft u chose good or bad. All this back and forth does not help answer any of my questions
JK-Forum Founder
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 36,534
Likes: 16
From: Laguna Niguel, CA
From: scott & cheryl frary
Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2011 12:58 PM
To: 'Eddie'
Subject: Tom Wood
Eddie-
Tom Wood and I were talking today about websites and I mentioned your site. He had very little knowledge of your site as he doesn’t have a lot of time to check various sites. He is interested in becoming a vendor on your site. Is this possible? You can contact him at t1@4xshaft . com
I see on the board that there are frequent DS questions and he would be a great source to answer those questions.
BTW- The picture you sent me is in the catalog in the PR 44 section.
Thanks again.
Scott
Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2011 12:58 PM
To: 'Eddie'
Subject: Tom Wood
Eddie-
Tom Wood and I were talking today about websites and I mentioned your site. He had very little knowledge of your site as he doesn’t have a lot of time to check various sites. He is interested in becoming a vendor on your site. Is this possible? You can contact him at t1@4xshaft . com
I see on the board that there are frequent DS questions and he would be a great source to answer those questions.
BTW- The picture you sent me is in the catalog in the PR 44 section.
Thanks again.
Scott
From: Eddie
Sent: Thursday, February 03, 2011 12:13 AM
To: Tom Wood
Subject: Fw: Tom Wood
Hello Mr. Wood,
I just got an email from Scott Frary saying that you might be interested in becoming a sponsor of www.Project-JK.com / www.JK-Forum.com. I know that you make real nice drive shafts and provide good customer service and, being that what you have to offer is something that would benefit our members, I would like to see if you might interested in signing up.
Sincerely,
Eddie
Sent: Thursday, February 03, 2011 12:13 AM
To: Tom Wood
Subject: Fw: Tom Wood
Hello Mr. Wood,
I just got an email from Scott Frary saying that you might be interested in becoming a sponsor of www.Project-JK.com / www.JK-Forum.com. I know that you make real nice drive shafts and provide good customer service and, being that what you have to offer is something that would benefit our members, I would like to see if you might interested in signing up.
Sincerely,
Eddie
This is the response he sent back...
From: Tom Wood
Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2011 4:19 PM
To: 'Eddie'
Subject: RE: Tom Wood
Eddie:
I sincerely apologize for the delay in responding. It has been incredibly busy around here and I have been out of town quite a bit over the last months. Things like this tend to have a lower priority. But not so low that it should have taken me a month and a half to get back with you. Time flys. Again I apologize.
Thank you for your comment of “I know that you make real nice drive shafts and provide good customer service and, being that what you have to offer is something that would benefit our members.” I am confident this is all accurate.
Scott has been a good friend of mine for quite a few years. He runs and believes in our product. He happened to mention that Coast Driveline was establishing quite a presence on your web site and suggested I not be left out. I see that your web site has a huge amount of traffic which could be good.
However… Recently, it has come to my attention recently that there has been some trash talk on your site about our product. One recent E-mail included this quote; “I was recently reviewing a discussion about buying new drive shafts for my jeep and was told by members of this forum that your driveshafts are made with cheap chinese parts. I PMed the person that wrote that and he told me that the owner at Coast told him that Bill at Coast shafts told him that. David at Northridge4x4 said that he was told the same thing.” The previous statement is untrue. The sender received a very detailed response explaining the whole truth.
It seems to me that for me to enter the mud on your site could open up a vendor war like we’ve never seen before. While it may be entertaining for your members, I simply don’t have the time for the game. Also, I would consider it unethical for me to go onto any site to “pimp our product.” If were to sign up as an advertiser right now, it may appear I am paying “hush money.” This is also something I would consider unethical.
I am not afraid to stand with any competitor as I truly believe our products are superior to those commonly available anywhere else. We use the same components in our “everyday drive shafts” as we do in the most rigerous, competition vehicles and have always done so.
It truly bothers me when a competitor will make false statements about another’s product, and statements based solely on hearsay or speculation, rather than simply touting their own positive points about their own product. I do not want to be a part of anything else.
If it ever turns out that vendors on your web site, are not allowed to trash talk their competitors with falsehoods, please let me know. I will be more than happy to consider your web site for my advertising dollars.
Thank you,
Tom Wood
Tom Wood's Custom Drive Shafts Inc.
Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2011 4:19 PM
To: 'Eddie'
Subject: RE: Tom Wood
Eddie:
I sincerely apologize for the delay in responding. It has been incredibly busy around here and I have been out of town quite a bit over the last months. Things like this tend to have a lower priority. But not so low that it should have taken me a month and a half to get back with you. Time flys. Again I apologize.
Thank you for your comment of “I know that you make real nice drive shafts and provide good customer service and, being that what you have to offer is something that would benefit our members.” I am confident this is all accurate.
Scott has been a good friend of mine for quite a few years. He runs and believes in our product. He happened to mention that Coast Driveline was establishing quite a presence on your web site and suggested I not be left out. I see that your web site has a huge amount of traffic which could be good.
However… Recently, it has come to my attention recently that there has been some trash talk on your site about our product. One recent E-mail included this quote; “I was recently reviewing a discussion about buying new drive shafts for my jeep and was told by members of this forum that your driveshafts are made with cheap chinese parts. I PMed the person that wrote that and he told me that the owner at Coast told him that Bill at Coast shafts told him that. David at Northridge4x4 said that he was told the same thing.” The previous statement is untrue. The sender received a very detailed response explaining the whole truth.
It seems to me that for me to enter the mud on your site could open up a vendor war like we’ve never seen before. While it may be entertaining for your members, I simply don’t have the time for the game. Also, I would consider it unethical for me to go onto any site to “pimp our product.” If were to sign up as an advertiser right now, it may appear I am paying “hush money.” This is also something I would consider unethical.
I am not afraid to stand with any competitor as I truly believe our products are superior to those commonly available anywhere else. We use the same components in our “everyday drive shafts” as we do in the most rigerous, competition vehicles and have always done so.
It truly bothers me when a competitor will make false statements about another’s product, and statements based solely on hearsay or speculation, rather than simply touting their own positive points about their own product. I do not want to be a part of anything else.
If it ever turns out that vendors on your web site, are not allowed to trash talk their competitors with falsehoods, please let me know. I will be more than happy to consider your web site for my advertising dollars.
Thank you,
Tom Wood
Tom Wood's Custom Drive Shafts Inc.
From: Eddie
Sent: Friday, March 25, 2011 8:51 AM
To: Tom Wood
Subject: Re: Tom Wood
Tom,
I hope you don’t take this the wrong way but, since you seem to have missed the irony in your email to me, I’d like to point out that you have contacted me to trash talk two supporters of mine and based solely on an email that you apparently got from someone – essentially, “hearsay”. Having said that, perhaps you could send me the “very detailed response explaining the whole truth”. Unless I missed it, you never did say where your parts are made and since this seems to be such a contentious issues, I think it would be beneficial for me to hear it straight from you.
Sincerely,
Eddie
Sent: Friday, March 25, 2011 8:51 AM
To: Tom Wood
Subject: Re: Tom Wood
Tom,
I hope you don’t take this the wrong way but, since you seem to have missed the irony in your email to me, I’d like to point out that you have contacted me to trash talk two supporters of mine and based solely on an email that you apparently got from someone – essentially, “hearsay”. Having said that, perhaps you could send me the “very detailed response explaining the whole truth”. Unless I missed it, you never did say where your parts are made and since this seems to be such a contentious issues, I think it would be beneficial for me to hear it straight from you.
Sincerely,
Eddie
From: Tom Wood
Sent: Friday, March 25, 2011 9:55 AM
To: 'Eddie'
Subject: RE: Tom Wood
Eddy:
Looking from your point of view, I see the irony. You are correct, I missed it.
The reasons for contacting you were twofold:
I think every E-mail deserves the dignity of a response.
Secondly, I wanted to explain to you my reasoning for not advertising, on such a popular site. When I am told “no,” I like to know the reason why. I assumed the same for you. I did not intend to be trash talking my competitors. It is not my style. That is why things were sent to you, privately, rather than a posting on your, public web site. I apologize if you thought otherwise. I assure you, this is not the case.
The question of “cheap Chinese parts” has been a come about in the past. I think it is time to put the whole truth out there on my web site. Since I have all the relevant texts in E-mail forms, I think I will review all the E-mail, and organize in a coherent manner, and post on my web site. I am sure with the “whole truth,” I will be able to put this “baby to bed,” once and for all.
Would your forum accept, and post an advance copy of this? If so, I would be happy to do such a thing for you, which would be more JK specific.
Sincerely,
Tom Wood
Tom Wood's Custom Drive Shafts Inc.
Sent: Friday, March 25, 2011 9:55 AM
To: 'Eddie'
Subject: RE: Tom Wood
Eddy:
Looking from your point of view, I see the irony. You are correct, I missed it.
The reasons for contacting you were twofold:
I think every E-mail deserves the dignity of a response.
Secondly, I wanted to explain to you my reasoning for not advertising, on such a popular site. When I am told “no,” I like to know the reason why. I assumed the same for you. I did not intend to be trash talking my competitors. It is not my style. That is why things were sent to you, privately, rather than a posting on your, public web site. I apologize if you thought otherwise. I assure you, this is not the case.
The question of “cheap Chinese parts” has been a come about in the past. I think it is time to put the whole truth out there on my web site. Since I have all the relevant texts in E-mail forms, I think I will review all the E-mail, and organize in a coherent manner, and post on my web site. I am sure with the “whole truth,” I will be able to put this “baby to bed,” once and for all.
Would your forum accept, and post an advance copy of this? If so, I would be happy to do such a thing for you, which would be more JK specific.
Sincerely,
Tom Wood
Tom Wood's Custom Drive Shafts Inc.
Annoyed by the whole thing, I never even bothered to respond to him and, had he not gone so completely stupid, I would have been willing to leave all this behind closed doors. But, being that Tom is such a wonderful salesman and one who I think may only be interested in lining his pockets with more profit while selling what I have seen to be an inferior u-joint, I think the TRUTH needs to be out there for eveyone to see.
Now, I should point out that we've made NO changes to how we do things around here since then and yet, this is an email that I got from Tom back on October 6th and 10th of 2011:
From: Tom Wood
Sent: Thursday, October 06, 2011 2:55 PM
To: 'Eddie'
Subject: Advertising;
Eddie.
Last March or so, I attempted to register on your site JKForum.com. The registration process was never approved. My first thought was you recognized my name and simply would not allow me to do so. After the fact though, and through others, I have learned that, you do not allow commercial interests to post unless they are paid advertisers. I guess I can understand this position. At least it keeps things known that the poster isn’t necessarily, unbiased.
At this time, I would like to consider being an advertiser on the JK Forum. Would you allow this? If so please send to me your standard rates along with their association to benefits and privileges on your web site.
Thank you,
Tom Wood
Tom Wood's Custom Drive Shafts Inc.
Sent: Thursday, October 06, 2011 2:55 PM
To: 'Eddie'
Subject: Advertising;
Eddie.
Last March or so, I attempted to register on your site JKForum.com. The registration process was never approved. My first thought was you recognized my name and simply would not allow me to do so. After the fact though, and through others, I have learned that, you do not allow commercial interests to post unless they are paid advertisers. I guess I can understand this position. At least it keeps things known that the poster isn’t necessarily, unbiased.
At this time, I would like to consider being an advertiser on the JK Forum. Would you allow this? If so please send to me your standard rates along with their association to benefits and privileges on your web site.
Thank you,
Tom Wood
Tom Wood's Custom Drive Shafts Inc.
From: Tom Wood
Sent: Monday, October 10, 2011 12:04 PM
To: Eddie
Subject: Advertising:
Eddie:
I sent you an E-mail last week about advertising on your sites. I have not received a response. Did you receive the E-mail? My guess at this point is; you will not allow me to advertise. If this is correct, please just let me know.Honestly, the reason I want to advertise is so that I will be allowed to post. I have recently studied your forum rules and now see this; “I understand that it is the policy of JK-Forum.com to NOT allow manufacturers, vendors, dealers, shops, Jeep related businesses, competing websites or for-profit publications to participate on and/or to solicit their products, services or websites anywhere on JK-Forum.com unless they are a sponsor of JK-Forum.com.” In my initial reading of your forum rules, I did not pick up on the “to participate” text in your rules.
Obviously, without me being an advertiser, you will not allow me to post about anything. If I cannot post, I see no reason to be a registered user of your forum and hereby reject any acceptance of your terms. With that being the case, and if you do not intend on allowing me to advertise, please note that I have rejected this portion of your terms and you may as well delete me as a registered user.
Alternative to that, you may certainly decide to allow me to advertise and I would look forward to your proposal.
Thank you,
Tom Wood
Tom Wood's Custom Drive Shafts Inc.
Sent: Monday, October 10, 2011 12:04 PM
To: Eddie
Subject: Advertising:
Eddie:
I sent you an E-mail last week about advertising on your sites. I have not received a response. Did you receive the E-mail? My guess at this point is; you will not allow me to advertise. If this is correct, please just let me know.Honestly, the reason I want to advertise is so that I will be allowed to post. I have recently studied your forum rules and now see this; “I understand that it is the policy of JK-Forum.com to NOT allow manufacturers, vendors, dealers, shops, Jeep related businesses, competing websites or for-profit publications to participate on and/or to solicit their products, services or websites anywhere on JK-Forum.com unless they are a sponsor of JK-Forum.com.” In my initial reading of your forum rules, I did not pick up on the “to participate” text in your rules.
Obviously, without me being an advertiser, you will not allow me to post about anything. If I cannot post, I see no reason to be a registered user of your forum and hereby reject any acceptance of your terms. With that being the case, and if you do not intend on allowing me to advertise, please note that I have rejected this portion of your terms and you may as well delete me as a registered user.
Alternative to that, you may certainly decide to allow me to advertise and I would look forward to your proposal.
Thank you,
Tom Wood
Tom Wood's Custom Drive Shafts Inc.
From: Eddie
Sent: Monday, October 10, 2011 3:20 PM
To: Tom Wood
Subject: Re: Advertising:
Tom,
In case you missed it, this past weekend was the Off Road Expo in Pomona, CA. We had a vehicle on display there and we spent the weekend visiting with our fans and friends in the industry. Needless to say, this is the reason why I had not responded to you sooner.
Regarding your account, it should have been set to “Declined” as you would not have been able to become a member of JK-Forum.com unless you were a sponsoring advertiser. The rules you’ve been quoting exist to inform you as much and whether you agreed to them or not is in reality, irrelevant. Having said that, I will have that adjustment made now.
As far as you becoming an advertiser goes, I’ve given this some thought and have come to the conclusion that you may not be a good fit for JK-Forum.com. I do appreciate your interest in sponsoring us but, I will have to decline your offer.
Sincerely,
Eddie
Sent: Monday, October 10, 2011 3:20 PM
To: Tom Wood
Subject: Re: Advertising:
Tom,
In case you missed it, this past weekend was the Off Road Expo in Pomona, CA. We had a vehicle on display there and we spent the weekend visiting with our fans and friends in the industry. Needless to say, this is the reason why I had not responded to you sooner.
Regarding your account, it should have been set to “Declined” as you would not have been able to become a member of JK-Forum.com unless you were a sponsoring advertiser. The rules you’ve been quoting exist to inform you as much and whether you agreed to them or not is in reality, irrelevant. Having said that, I will have that adjustment made now.
As far as you becoming an advertiser goes, I’ve given this some thought and have come to the conclusion that you may not be a good fit for JK-Forum.com. I do appreciate your interest in sponsoring us but, I will have to decline your offer.
Sincerely,
Eddie
Since all this is apparently out in the open now, here is a copy of the letter that Tom Woods sent me and with the hopes of keeping the TRUTH from all of you....
These are the FACTS and the TRUTH and if Tom Woods was half a man, he'd admit as much. Hell, if he were smart enough, he'd know that I have been telling the truth about his u-joints for A LONG time and well before he ever asked Scott Frary to have me contact him. This is a fact and one that you can prove just by doing a simple search on this forum. Of course, I'm sure the fanboys will do what they always do and just choose to believe whatever it is they want to believe.
So that it's clear, my only reason for wanting people to run quality u-joints is because I have seen inferior u-joints break time and time again. A break on the trail is never any fun, it can ruin everyones day and I'm just trying to keep you from being "that guy".
Was that a good enough example of a non answer mister damon.l?
Last edited by wayoflife; Jan 9, 2012 at 07:43 AM.
JK Newbie
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
From: Indianapolis, IN
Against my better judgement I have to say this....
If you would allow the forum to be open and allow vendors like Tom Woods to come and defend themselves in an open forum maybe he could address these concerns. Since you won't allow a vendor to be on the site unless they pay you to pimp their wares he is unable to do so. As I read Tom's emails, I think he clearly said he's not interested in paying you to be able to post and he's not interested in 'my shaft versus yours' kinda of advertisement.
Seems in this instance Tom is being the bigger man.
If you would allow the forum to be open and allow vendors like Tom Woods to come and defend themselves in an open forum maybe he could address these concerns. Since you won't allow a vendor to be on the site unless they pay you to pimp their wares he is unable to do so. As I read Tom's emails, I think he clearly said he's not interested in paying you to be able to post and he's not interested in 'my shaft versus yours' kinda of advertisement.
Seems in this instance Tom is being the bigger man.
Last edited by wayoflife; Jan 9, 2012 at 07:43 AM.
JK-Forum Founder
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 36,534
Likes: 16
From: Laguna Niguel, CA
Since you won't allow a vendor to be on the site unless they pay you to pimp their wares he is unable to do so.
since you don't have a clue, allow me to explain that it is our sponsoring advertisers that make it possible for YOU to use this forum and shoot off your mouth like you know what you're talking about, 100% FREE of charge.
As I read Tom's emails, I think he clearly said he's not interested in paying you to be able to post and he's not interested in 'my shaft versus yours' kinda of advertisement.
Seems in this instance Tom is being the bigger man.
JK-Forum Founder
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 36,534
Likes: 16
From: Laguna Niguel, CA
"I have learned that, you do not allow commercial interests to post unless they are paid advertisers. I guess I can understand this position. At least it keeps things known that the poster isn’t necessarily, unbiased."
Of course, you're free to disagree with him just to keep on believing whatever it is you want to believe.
JK Freak
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 892
Likes: 0
From: Euless, TX
"You state the truth"...give me a fucking break. You wouldn't know the truth if it beat you across the head.
A lot of manufacturers make parts overseas and are quality parts. A failure is a failure.
I will remove myself from the debate and agree to disagree.
JK-Forum Founder
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 36,534
Likes: 16
From: Laguna Niguel, CA
You don't know the truth dumb ass.
Tom can't post here.
A lot of manufacturers make parts overseas and are quality parts. A failure is a failure.
I will remove myself from the debate and agree to disagree.