resharp001

My BullDog will allows me to turn it off completely, or change the threshold at which I want the alert triggered. That said, can't recommend it. Works for me....I hate when I have to mess around with it...which is rarely.

mr72

Yep, same here. Before I updated the firmware it would let you set the thresholds and also completely disable TPMS, although it came with the warning that once disabled you might not be able to turn it back on. But after the update it will only disable the threshold alarm (essentially setting the threshold to 0 psi). But it will still fire the TPMS warning light if you have a missing sensor on a rolling tire, and of course it still reads tire pressure for all 4 tires if you scroll to it. But even worse, after the firmware update, the pressure threshold is disabled and there is no way to turn it back on. Frankly, I like the TPMS feature and I happen to run my tires at the OEM specified pressure since they have the best gas mileage there, and I would like it if I could get it to come back on like stock. It won't. Even a complete "reset to stock" does not work. Oh, and it would be almost worth trying to hassle with their support but I would need an antique Windows computer to do anything... and that's something I just don't have and don't care for.

Yeah if I had it to do over again I'd buy that. FWIW I never intended to use my Flashcal to mess with the TPMS and I'm sorry I fooled with it. But it does work for calibrating the speedometer for tire size, and it works to turn on and off features like DRL, fog lights with high beams, lane change indicator, radio delay, etc.

Considering that the Flashcal works for everything except TPMS, something tells me TPMS is especially finicky. AEV seems to have the magic worked out.

I still think they are all a racket.

The real racket is that we have to buy something like this to do routine things. Any old bluetooth OBD2 adapter should work and let you set this stuff with a $4.99 Android app. But as long as we keep paying $150 for a semi-functional VIN-locked doodad, why would anyone develop something better?

ourjeeps

Sharing some "uncommon sense" here..." TPMS does NOT have to be this darn hard or expensive but it IS (thank you brain-dead bureaucrats). You really don't need positional tire pressures in passenger vehicles - just alertment of one of four tires with an issue, is sufficient... .

Our dearly departed "bad-boy" VW TDi diesels multi-purposed the existing vehicle ABS system (as in NO additional in wheel RF sensors/aging sensor batteries in the wheels, and NO ECU programming that forum posters are complaining about) and the ABS system monitored wheel rotation speeds as they already do for braking contol. Think about it - under-inflated tires/those losing pressure (surprise) have a smaller rolling diameter, and the VW ABS system detected and alerted the driver of one or more tire problems based upon a rotational speed differential (note - system is smart enough to compensate for turns (inner tires turn more slowly, outer faster...)).

As such, when alerted, you pull over quickly and safely, and conduct a visual inspection backed up with a old-fashioned tire pressure gauge - and voila! - quickly identify the victim/failed tire. Again this technical approach requires - NO in-wheel Radio Frequency (RF) sensors/aging sensor batteries in the wheels, and NO ECU programming, and NO ~$200-$500 TPMS programmer.

How does that wise logistics/support saying go?!?! "Keep It Simple Stupid?!?!" (Not to say ABS is simple, but it's already there and certainly versatile)

Since we now (unfortunately) have several vehicles with RF TPMS, and multiple sets of tires, we bit the bullet and bought a commercial-grade TPMS programmer (only 2-years of included s/w upgrades BTW) so we would not have to run to the well-equipped tire shops. Note our preferred old-fashioned family owned tire shop doesn't even have a TPMS programmer. Now considering getting a tire machine (mount/dismount/balance) another story... to free us from increasing tire shop dependencies... welcome to the modern world of technology dependency!!! When the big EMP weapons hit, semiconductor operated devices, and the power grid will be toast, along with our modern Jeeps/etc. Sometimes I just prefer the old 60's/70's muscle cars/trucks - motors, carbs, tranny's... not much more (sigh...).

Irrespective of above, aftermarket universal TPMS systems with external sensors and receiver (relocatable between tire sets/vehicles and no ECU programming required) in the $300-$500 price range can be VALUABLE safety systems for RVs and dually trucks with TRAILERS with multiple trouble-prone trailer tires, and for particularly tire intensive 18-wheelers... [at least until the EMPs hit ;-) ] E.g. see Texas based Tire Tracker TireTraker? TPMS - Tire Pressure Monitoring System for more info, there are many other aftermarket mgfs/vendors, look for both price and more importantly, warranty support.

mr72

Yes, it would be sufficient and probably even satisfy the bureaucrats. But I find the wheel sensors to be a pretty handy feature, making it quick and easy to verify the tire pressure in all four rolling tires without having to go around and check them with a manual gauge. Sure, that's just a convenience feature, but it is what it is. Nice to know which tire is doing what.

This is actually the way all early TPMS worked, and this is commonly considered the "old way" or maybe an outdated way of doing it. And the big thing is it is far less accurate. It can tell you one tire is extremely low but it can't tell you one tire is 2 psi low. The resolution is very poor. And a 10% (in our case, 3-4 psi) reduction in tire pressure will dramatically change braking and cornering performance, not to mention fuel economy. So I think this old kind of system that really is only any good to tell if the tire is "sort of normal" (25+ psi) or "very low" (single-digit PSI) is just barely above useless as a safety feature.

Remember all of this started with the rash of Ford Explorer crashes that resulted from blowouts due to underinflated tires. Firestone took the PR hit for this but the reality is that Ford had recommended too-low tire pressures in effort to improve ride quality in Explorers and it was only marginally safe. The response from the bureaucrats is "we can't trust auto manufacturers" so they mandated TPMS to alert drivers when a tire was dangerously low enough to cause a blowout. So that's all that this first-generation type ABS-based system is really good for, telling you if a tire is likely to blow out due to low pressure.

I tend to agree but if you want to be able to centrally monitor tire pressure with more than a 10 psi resolution then the RF-based system really is as simple as it gets.

The complaints people have are not really about the complexity or really unreliability of the system. Most complaints I see are people who are resistant to change and think that the car telling them their tire is low is intrusive. They think they know more than the manufacturer about what the tire pressure should be, and they are usually wrong. That's the exact reason the system is needed. There are also off-roaders want the ability to turn off the warnings when they intentionally deflated the tires, which is a fair request. So rather than making the system more "simple", the auto manufacturers could more likely just make it possible for users to disable it. The really easy and simple thing for Jeep to do would be to disable TPMS alarms when the vehicle is in 4wd.

Just to clarify and for completeness of accurate information... on a Jeep JK, a TPMS programmer is not only unnecessary but also has no effect. Now, you could do with a tool that will allow you to read the ID of the sensor via RF and verify that the sensor is programmed into the ECU, which I presume your tool does. But the JK's pressure sensors are universal provided you have one of the right frequency for your vehicle. They don't require programming. Other cars differ, of course. I've had this argument many times with tire shops.

Rednroll

I turned mine off with the F5 Superchips FlashCal programmer. I also no longer have the TP sensors in my tires, but I had them in my previous tires before I purchased my larger tires. The FlashCal had no problem turning it off either way.

The F5 is the most recent and still supported by SC. It also has the threshold adjustments for TPMS if you would like that feature.

https://www.amazon.com/Superchips-3571-Flashcal-F5-Tuner/dp/B019SNGGJI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1518695915&sr=8-1&keywords=JK+Wrangler+Superchips+F5+Flashcal
Don't buy this one. It's no longer supported by SC and does not have the threshold adjustment.
https://www.amazon.com/SUPERCHIP-SAME-AS-3872-PROGRAMMER/dp/B01LK6E8PA/ref=sr_1_2?s=automotive&ie=UTF8&qid=1518696128&sr=1-2&keywords=JK+Wrangler+Superchips+Flashcalhttps://www.amazon.com/Superchips-3872-Flashpaq-Tuner-Engine/dp/B00HZH66ZY/ref=sr_1_fkmr0_2?s=automotive&ie=UTF8&qid=1518696128&sr=1-2-fkmr0&keywords=JK+Wrangler+Superchips+Flashcal
The reason I turned mine off was due to the hassle of maintaining them and troubleshooting them. My 2009 only has the single idiot light which is only useful to let you know a tire is low, but not useful enough to tell you which tire or tires are low. I purchased 2 replacement sensors due to the aluminum cracking on the stems where the light was on prior to that...thought the most likely reason for the light being on was because I could no longer inflate or check the pressure in those 2 tires. I paid $90 a piece for those 2 sensor replacements. The tire shop couldn't figure out why my idiot light still wouldn't go out. They checked all of them, and they checked out fine according to them. It could have been the $90 new ones were the wrong frequency, or the older ones the batteries in them were too old. I just decided to eliminate 2 problems by getting rubber valve stems that wouldn't crack and fall apart like the aluminum stems that come on the sensors, and eliminate the sensors. I then just turned off the idiot light with the SC FlashCal. If you live in a state that has road salt during the winter like I do, you eventually learn that the aluminum valve stems on the sensors will fall apart which is a safety hazard in itself.

mr72

The confusing thing is that the old version (which I have) USED TO allow you to turn it off and also adjust the threshold, but a firmware "upgrade" rendered it not able to do it.

Now, the conspiracy theorist in me thinks SC did this deliberately to encourage users to buy the new one. And so I'm highly suspicious that when/if SC ever comes out with another new device they might render the F5 unusable as they did the current one. AFAIK there's no (supported) way to return to the previous firmware on the old one.

Yes I think this encapsulates the problem quite well. It's not so much that there's anything wrong or bad about the TPMS system as designed. But it's tire shops that don't know how to fix it that is the problem, and a big part of that problem is there are so many variations on how auto makers implement TPMS systems that tire shops get confused. Then the internet gets clogged with a mix of correct and incorrect information and everyone gets confused.

The right sensors can be had for like $65 for "genuine" Mopar (which are actually manufactured by someone else, I can't recall who) or for about $15 if you don't want to pay the FCA branding upcharge. If you now what you are getting then you can get the right parts and any tire shop that can break the bead can replace them. Everything goes haywire when you ask the tire shop to help diagnose. Any Discount Tire shop can use a tool to detect if a sensor is working or not. If a shop says they have to "program" the sensors or the system then hang up and go somewhere else.

I wrote up a more extensive description of the system before after banging my head against the wall trying to solve my own problems. I should dig it up and link it here. But for this thread I'd summarize: the stock TPMS is pretty useful if you keep it working, cheap and easy to maintain, but most tire shops can't diagnose problems correctly and overcharge for the wrong parts to fix. AEV Procal is a programmer that seems to reliably work to adjust/disable the TPMS if you want to go that route, but the Flashcal is known to not work correctly in some editions so buyer beware.

resharp001

I wouldn't doubt this one bit. More than anything, I can see them not focusing much on supporting the older model. It's the same racket with cellphones.....sure, you can have company's like Apple "claim" that their slowing things down on older models to "help" conserve your older battery, but come on...they need to sell new phones, and if people are frustrated enough with their old phone, they'll upgrade.

Your write up has been the best explanation of the TPMS system that I've seen to date. It should probably just be a sticky.

mr72

[QUOTE=resharp001;4314707 More than anything, I can see them not focusing much on supporting the older model. It's the same racket with cellphones.....[/QUOTE]

It's one thing to just stop updating the older model and allow it to remain functional. It's quite another to push out an update to the old model that cripples its functionality. Your comparison to Apple is spot-on, but Apple is more artful about it, trying to maintain the veneer of customer service while SC seems willing to just ignore customers.