oh man, that one actually hurt a little

 

If there's one thing I agree with in this thread, is the above statement ...

I reviewed Dana-Spicer and Neapco Web sites and found more clarity on Neapco's site regarding point of manufacture and some tangible evidence they have a quality management system in place - which I assume is why JE Reel is using Neapco components.

So, the mystery regarding Mr. Wood's source of design / manufacturing is the same for Dana-Spicer and their point of manufacture - we know they design their own products. I see zero evidence Wood or Dana-Spicer components are manufactured in a plant that is ISO certified - a basic step to assuring they have a QMS in place. I don't see CE marks anywhere on their sales literature, which tells me it could be made anywhere.

At least Neapco publishes which manufacturing sites have ISO registrations and the certified body. Note they have a component shop in Mexico.

http://w w w.neapco.com/nC-technology-quality.php

If you guys wish to discuss global manufacturing and quality management systems I'm open to providing some insight - I've been in Medical Device manufacturing for 35 years. Which includes ISO 13485 Certification, FDA and IMB compliance.

The chances a cheaper (low cost) U-joint that is designed and manufactured in China is pretty high... and "reversed engineered" is a huge RED FLAG in my book. The average manufacturing hourly wage is $16.00/hr in Norh America, as compared to $4.00/hr in China.

I "Wood" pursue the design specifications more than I "Wood" the point of manufacture... haha, that was a funny.

 

When things get tense in driveshaft threads......random humor works 60% of the time, every time.

 

WOW, that was informative, thanks

......

 

For whatever it's worth, I had talked to Jim Reel a few months back about u-joints and asked why he uses Neapco. And, what he told me was an interesting story about how there was a time a few years back that he was approached by a company that wanted to sell him high quality Chinese u-joints. They assured him that the quality of the u-joints would meet or exceed what he was using and for a fraction of the price. In fact, the savings he would see would be significant enough that it was hard not to give them a try. And so, he asked for a few sample so that he could have them tested. And, when the results came back, he was truly amazed. Needless to say, he decided to start using these u-joints and, for a while, all was good. But then, over time, he started to get more and more complaints regarding his drive shafts and the u-joints failing. Suspecious, he decided to take some of the u-joints he had and do some random tests on them. What he found was that while a lot were still meeting the standards he was promised, more than enough weren't and it became clear to him that continuing to use these u-joints would not be right. In the end, the problem was in quality control and, while some were getting lucky, more than enough that weren't. And, rather than make his customers take the gamble in what they get, he decided to bite the bullet and just use what he knew was right, regardless of how much profit he would loose. Needless to say, JE Reel is neither as affordable as Tom Woods nor as popular but, at least if you get one of his shafts, you know that you will be getting one of the most high quality u-joint around.

Having said all that, I would be the first to tell you that I used to say that Spicer u-joints were made in America and, after being presented by some reasonable facts from reasonable people, I have long since changed my tune and no longer say as much. Does this mean I won't use them? Of course not. Clearly, whoever makes them and wherever they are made, a higher standard of quality control is enforced and the proof of that is in what I've seen on the trail. This is why I still recommend them or Neapco. As far as Gold Seal u-joints go, believe what you will but I simply cannot make this stuff up. Why a company would continue to use them in spite of what they know is beyond me. That, or the only thing they are most concerned with is making a buck off of you.

 

Anyone using CTM Racing Products U-Joints?.... I've never heard of them before, I read some stuff about them on Bob Is The Oil Guy site. CTM Racing is in SoCal, kind of pricey... if you're looking for strength and don't mind breaking axles as opposed to u-joints they may be the ticket..

 

I run CTM's on our Dynatrac ProRock 60 front axles. They are pricey but about as good as it gets.

 

If another thing is certain.. people that test and use these components in extreme conditions put their reputations on the line. I think you have a lot more lose than any TOM, DICK or HARRY BALLS that walk through here and supports their buddies. But then again, this is about relationships and developing trust.. I for one, would not use and endorse a low cost U-Joint at the expense of damaging my reputation.

There's bigger things to worry about in life...

.02

 

MY J.E. Reels obviously came with the Neapco's. But as WoL has done with his PR60 front, I will replace what ever came with my Foote Competition axles in my ProRock 60, with my 300m CTM spares.

 

Nice pics planman, looks like you had a lot of fun.

The problems I've seen with Gold Seal u-joints typically happend right away - within a few thousand miles. This happend to one of the participants of the JK-Experience. The guy trailered his Jeep from VA to CO, wasn't able to wheel most of the trip due to problems with his HEMI and then, on the last day or, the first time he got to really wheel, his brand new Tom Woods drive shaft blew a u-joint not even half way into the trail. If you haven't had any problems, you're probably one of the lucky ones and really, I'm sure there are more of you than not. My problem is that the potential for getting a bad u-joint is high enough that I try and steer people away from them. Why take the risk is how I see it. If you still want to buy a Wood's shaft, I wouldn't stop you or anyone from doing so but, like I always say, just make sure to upgrade your u-joints to something you know is going to be good.

Serviceable just means you can grease it and, just because you can doesn't mean that it still doesn't have moving parts that spin really fast and will wear out. Likewise, just because a serviceless u-joint can't be greased doesn't mean it's going to fail prematurely. In fact, replacing them once a year would be a waste of money in my opinion especially if you don't do a lot of driving. Of course, if you do put on a lot of miles and live in a state that sees a lot of water, snow and salt, once every 2 years or about 30,000 miles would be a good interval to replace your u-joints. certainly, factory u-joints are made by spicer and there are plenty of people who do way more than that and probably have yet to change out anything.

And, I disagree. As I have noted in the story that JE Reel told me, the problem is in quality control. One test would mean nothing. There's nothing to speculate when you see failure after failure on the trail and those aren't random anecdotal experiences. Or, at least not to me.